S4 of woe

[JackS4]

Hi all,

Sorry to kick off my first post with a moan. I have been lurking here for a couple of years as a guest but would really appreciate any help.

I bought an Audi Approved S4 V8 avant last August which had been registerd 4 months earlier (I previously had an S3). In the first month of ownership and allowing for me to get used to some of the quirks of this particular model (high clutch bite-point etc) I brought it back to the stealer with a few things that didnt feel quite right.

First off the gear shift grinds at the end of the throw into 2nd, 3rd and 4th and if trying make a quick (not GP) getaway the car remained stationery while the engine revved away.

As you might expect I got the usual stealer response of them not being able to reproduce the faults etc until I suggested one of their senior techs take it home for the night.

On the transmission issue they reckoned they had it fixed (er not) and on the second issue a new clutch and flywheel was replaced . After another month of sending it back on the first issue they suddenly felt the need to replace the gearbox.

This is getting long winded so I will truncate it to say that the car has been back with the stealer once or twice a month with the ongoing transmission grinding and other minor faults. I have also had the ECU light come on twice and both times the car had to be recovered to the stealer. This was something to do with lose bolts on an inlet manifold. Audi have also updated throttle software and last week updated software on the transmission (car is manual ).

I am now seriously pi$$ed off to the point that I no longer want the car as a result of the faults and the uncertainty around its reliability. Clearly if I try and sell the car most people would run a mile and or I will be savaged by depreciation because of this.

The car is currently awaiting a back to back test by Audi UK before entertaining any conversations around rejection etc.

Anyone got experience of what to do in this situation ?

Thanks in advance.





I have now

[JohnW]

My sister has returned two cars due to high fault counts (not an Audi I should add).
The best one was half the bolts missing from the rear suspension !!!

What you need to do is detail all of the faults giving times, dates, names, etc.
For example, when the car went wrong, when they have had it and for how long, who you spoke to.

If they have been unable to fix this fault even though it has been returned on several occasions then I would say you have a very strong case. After all there are only so many times they should try to fix something.

In my sisters case she was given another car rather than her money back.

Good luck !

Cheers,
John.

[JackS4]

Thanks for the reply John.

As a matter of interest how long did your sister have the car(s) and what kind of mileage did she put up ? Was this a big issue for the stealer ?

Thanks again,

Jack

[JohnW]

I don't think it was a big issue. I got the impression from her that they were as fed up with the cars as she was.

The first car she had for a year.

Just like you it was at the dealers at least once a month. This was a rover 100.
They replaced it with another rover 100, but the next model up.
This was the one that had a suspension knock. Dealer had to get authorisation from manufacturers to strip interior to go looking for the noise. Engineer from factory came down and was stunned at what he found.
The same car also developed an engine fault, and when the stripped the inlet manifold off found it still had masking tape partially obscuring one of the cylinders. It was at this point the dealer suggested the car could have more problems and should be returned.

Second car was an MG from the same dealer but a few years on.
I forget which MG but it is the 216 sized one - ZS ?
This car she had for some time too. Not exactly sure of how long, but I
would say probably a year too. This car would play games with the locks
and would lock people in or out of the car as it felt like.
It also stopped on the motorway a few times for no apparent reason.

She got this one taken back and has replaced it with the same model but newer, at her expense.

As I say, lots of written accounts always helps to substatiate what has gone on.
If you've always taken it to the same dealer they cannot hide the proof of booking, etc.

Cheers,
John.

[JackS4]

Thanks again John.

I had captured my recollection (high level) in an e-amil to the dealer last month but I bet their detailed records make more interesting reading. I will ask for this.

Any ideas with regard to consumer protection regulations as a back stop if Audi start playing silly games ? What difference would it make that the car was 2nd hand effectively ?

Also, suggestions for a replacement are welcome.

Many thanks,

Jack

[Scotty]

Sorry to hear you're not enjoying your car due to the problems. I really think we should have a lemon law in the UK like in the US.

Perhaps you can help me (us). I'm having the throttle s/w down next week but this isn't to do with the trnasmission. My dealer are confused by even this. Do you know the description or part number of the s/w CD or the Service Bulletin that it relates to? Any info would be appreciated.

How is your car now? There were some early gearbox issues that Audi resolved but do you have any other issues?

[JackS4]

Scotty,

A lemon is certainly one way to describe my cars problems !

I dont recall the part no./ref for the throttle s/w CD but a call to Audi UK will sort that one. They certainly knew about it when I contacted them about the inconsistant throttle response on my car when like you my dealer knew nothing about it. It will be interesting to see what effect if any this has on your AmD remap.

You might also ask your dealer/Audi about the transmission s/w update (adjusts the revs on shifts). My dealer only told me about this after they had done it (the cynic in me thinks that this is a fix for problems they must be experiencing on other S4's). This does make for noticeably easier progress through the gears when pushing on though and is well worth doing imho.

Jack

[Scotty]

Thanks for that.

The throttle s/w means I have to go to AMD and get them to unmap the car first. They will try and apply it and if sucessful then remap it. If not then I'll be running this weekends trackday without the map and having to return to them after Audi have done their stuff.

The transmission s/w update I've asked the dealer about. I'm waiting on a call back from Audi Customer service about another issue (lack of ISOFIX) so I may mention this as well.

So how is your car now? Is everything ok except your lack of confidence in it?

[JackS4]

Scotty,

The car - still grinds gears at the end of the throw into 2nd, 3rd and 4th (current gearbox is only 6 weeks old). They (Audi UK) are now awaiting a back to back test with another S4 but to be honest it has been doing this since day one. Unhelpfully after their last attempt at fixing this a couple of weeks ago they seem to have broken the gear lever surround to add insult to injury.

My real issue given their inability to fix the transmission grinding is my confidence in the car. It has already sat down on me twice and frankly with one baby and another on the way this is not something I can live with and certainly not at this kind of money (my own too to make matters worse).

Pity as the car ticks a lot of boxes for me.

So whats the Stage 3 like ? I got myself an Xmas present of a CAT back from AmD.

Jack

[Morpheous]

I agree to the gearbox moan, but how can you blame the network for warning lights and poor drivability when an AMD remap it sitting in the ecu.
Fair enough I have no probs with tinkering but don't slam the network when it goes tits up possibly due to tinkering.
Seems to be lots of engine lights on due to the AMD stuff.
There is no software update for the transmission on a manual.
You may find its a drivability update which will be flashed to the engine ecu for manual cars, this may wipe your AMD stuff.
They may also replace the ecu, when it goes back to the factory for evaluation and they see spurious code in there, you may find yourself with a large bill.
Is the car going back to Milton Keynes for evaluation?

[Scotty]

[1] Morpheous - I have the AMD, Jack doesn't. I don't have problems. Jack does.
[2] "Seems to be lots of engine lights on due to the AMD stuff. " - please nlighten me as this is not something I've heard of?
[3] my dealer have said there is a transmission s/w update for a manual and Jack's had it. I'm confused.
[4] As I said in my post AMD are taking their code off for the s/w upgrade.
[5] Why would they replace the ECU? Why would I get a large bill?

Very confused?

[JackS4]

I agree to the gearbox moan, but how can you blame the network for warning lights and poor drivability when an AMD remap it sitting in the ecu.
Fair enough I have no probs with tinkering but don't slam the network when it goes tits up possibly due to tinkering.
Seems to be lots of engine lights on due to the AMD stuff.
There is no software update for the transmission on a manual.
You may find its a drivability update which will be flashed to the engine ecu for manual cars, this may wipe your AMD stuff.
They may also replace the ecu, when it goes back to the factory for evaluation and they see spurious code in there, you may find yourself with a large bill.
Is the car going back to Milton Keynes for evaluation?

To echo Sotty's post:
My S4 is not remapped. The warning lights and the gearbox issues happened well before I fitted a CAT back which, by choice does not really alter power (seeing as my car struggles with the power it has already).

The dealer told me they updated the ECU with new s/w for manual transmissions. I am not sure why they would make this up and besides I have noticed a positive difference (not to the gearbox grinding).

The back to back test will be at the dealer but taking instructions from Audi UK technical.

I would like to add that I have no issues with the dealer and their service has been fine. My issue is what appears to be some fundamental issues with the car itself which have not been corrected despite what will be I think 10 attempts next time it goes back to Audi. Again.

I hope this is helpful.

Jack

[Morpheous]

Sorry for the confusion guys, must read the posts properly, see lots of people slagging Centres.
Ah so your pulling the bad code B4 the car goes in? If it had been left in and the Centre was unable to flash your ecu, for whatever reason, they would change it and send the old one back. The bad code would be discovered resulting in the warranty claim being kicked out. Seen this happen frequently.
Yes problems do arise which the factory strive to fix, they don't deliberately piss their customers off for a laugh, look at how the technology has taken off, the car is a bloody network of computers now, the techs arn't super human, its the same brains working on the old beetles as the latest A8.
What grips my <beep> is the sales person in Germany are two a penny and the techs are treated and paid like doctors.
Arse about face here.
Just think what the next ten years will bring, 42V base systems with the same unit being utilised for the starter and alternator on the end of the crank.
Thought it only needed three faults the same to back it

[JackS4]

@Morpheous

I am guessing you work for Audi.

Are faults with common with S4 V8's ? If so what are the major common faults ?

Cheers,

Jack

[Scotty]

@Morpheous

I am guessing you work for Audi.

I thought the same. Perhaps all the negative vibes gave it away.