Ticket given for doing 32 mph in a 20mph zone -wot can i do?

[saf]

Ive been sent a ticket for 3 points and £60 for speeding at 32mph in a 20 zone.

I think its ridiculous.

They sent the photographic evidence of the car. Its was extremely dark and the driver couldnt be seen so i cant even prove it wasnt me driving.

Is there anything I could do.

The driver of the car at the time lives abroad, and its been difficult getting hold of him as he lives in a village. I have an address for him but theres not even telephone there.

I gave that address to the police on the form and they have replied askign me for flight detials of his arrival and departure , his foreign psotal address which is very vague as they dont have house numbers or postal codes there, also his insurance detials. How am I supposed to find all that out?

I been told that it will be heard in front of a magistrates hearing if i cant provide the full details.

they quote road and dtaffic act 1988 Section 172.

Can anyone advise me on what I could do?

Thanks

[RS4Kev]

Start with a visit to our friends at http://www.pepipoo.com and good luck

[CliveH]

How about asking the person who you let drive the car...?

[Ads4]

Ditto the above. Surely your friend who you lent your car to shouldn't be too hard to trace?

[saf]

How about asking the person who you let drive the car...?

Come on clive, stating the obvious again mate!! lol

Well I would ask him but hes had to leave the country in a hurry as his father was in bad health.

He lives out in the sticks where there is no phone. Bit difficult to get hold of him as ive said before.


My main point was due to the fact that ive been asked for information that A) seems to go against the data protection act, and
B) the information asked is is none of my business anyhow.How am I supposed to get flight detials and insurance details, It has nothign to do with me.

Only way I can really get hold of him is to go abroad and find him which isnt really feasable. His address doesnt even have a bloody house number, just a road name and area.

He had the car for 2 days because he was doing some paint work on it for me.

any HELP would be appreciated. Thanks

Thanks RS4Kev, useful link there mate.

[tanoga]

Saf

I assume you have received a "Notice of Intended Prosecution"
I further assume that you are the registered keeper of the vehicle detailed on the NIP As the registered keeper of the vehicle you are required to name the person who you have reason to believe was driving the vehicle at the time of the alleged offence. Complete the NIP with your friends name and last know address. That is your responsibility completed with regard to the NIP. Please bear in mind the insurance issue though. Is it reasonable for someone to lend a car to someone else without making sure that the vehicle is insured. You have said you lent your friend the car to do some paint work. Was this on a commercial basis Do you have a receipt/invoice for the work carried out If it was on a commercial basis I would argue that it is fair to assume that your friend would have insurance via the business without asking for it. If it was not on a commercial basis I believe it is reasonable to argue that you should have confirmed the insurance situation prior to lending your car to a friend. The reason you are being asked about the insurance situation is so that the old bill have an opportunity to investigate a vehicle being driven on the road without any proof of it being insured.

Good luck.

[derdle]

The car is yours, so you have to insure it. Was your friend a named driver on the policy or (as is normally the case) the policy is restricted to named drivers? Your friend cannot insure the car as he has no insurable interest (it is not his property).

[GrahamS4]

I would bend over backwards to assist the police and prove yourself innocent rather than resist in this case. Otherwise your version of events might understandably sound like a half thought out story to get out of facing the fine, for which I expect you will land in a lot more trouble than the original offence.

[tanoga]

The car is yours, so you have to insure it. Was your friend a named driver on the policy or (as is normally the case) the policy is restricted to named drivers? Your friend cannot insure the car as he has no insurable interest (it is not his property).

This is true, but the friend could have an insurance policy (assuming he owns a vehicle in the UK) of his own that allows him to drive another vehicle (3rd part only) not owned by him so long as he has the owners consent.

[derdle]

And you would let someone drive your RS4 on a 3rd party only basis? I know I wouldn't. If the friend lives in Ireland (where they don't have postcodes and many places have poor addresses) then maybe allow him to drive a RHD car, but if he comes from any otehr EU country it would be "unwise" (imho) to allow him/her to drive such a car because he'd be used to left hookers.

To entrust someone to drive your car, you must know him/her pretty well - do you have a mobile number?

In addition, more and more insurance policies nowadays have removed the ability to drive others cars on a 3rd party basis.

These are all sorts of things you could be asked.

Paul

Paul

[quattrokid1]

if you have given the police his name and address as demanded in the ITP as best you can as previously mentioned already, then let the police track him down, they want to persue it so let them do a bit of work for a change rather than given all details on a plate.
I assume you were not in the vehicle at the time?? if thats the case I dont think the police can pin it on you instead just because your the registered owner?

[tanoga]

And you would let someone drive your RS4 on a 3rd party only basis?

No chance. Bear in mind though, an insurance policy on a 3rd party only basis could be used to stop an investigation in its tracks of allowing the car to be driven uninsured at the time of the alleged offence

[tartan_rob]

I am sorry to say that the main issue here is that you gave information without understanding the fuller consequences. The insurance being an example of that. Had you said it was a mate in the UK, they would assume they were driving on their motor insurance, albeit third party only.

For reference, when caught speeding, deny that it was you but there was a crowd of you in the car and if they can identify who was driving at the time by the photo then you can give them a name. Bottom line is that if you don't know who was driving due to a bad memory, then you don't know and if the photo can't help...Oops. BUT - and its a big but and only works in conjunction with the previous statement, you must prove to them BEYOND REASONABLE DOUBT that you have been unable to trace the driver. YOU MUST ALSO infer that you have shown due diligence in finding out who was driving.

You could, and I'm not saying you should do this, find someone in France with a similiar surname, send the Police his name and address and tell them you have no idea how he got to the UK. You did not discuss this, however, they have the power and know-how to search the cross channel routes to find this traveller. They can do this but they won't - too much hassle. In any event, invite them to help you help them.

Remember: You are innocent until proven guilty, they have to prove it was you driving, despite section 172 or other. Currently (from your post), all they can do is to prove the car was travelling at that speed on that road through the speed camera. Hand the fine to the car give the car the points.

Or, get off on a technicality, like they have crimped or enhanced the photo etc
Or, take the points and the fine on basis that if you fight it and loose, you may end up worse off.

On the NIP thing, you should also be aware of the 'Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty Notice' which gets round the earlier requirement that a fixed penalty notice could only be issued at the time of the incident. The legislation for this is Section 75 of the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988. This natty piece of legislation allows the police to send out fixed penalty notices for camera-detected offences (ie. GATSOs and the like).

[derdle]

Have you checked the road markings and calculated whether the speed is actually 32mph. People have been sent such NIP's when the car has been under the limit.

The other thing to consider is that doing 32 in a 20 zone means that the car was doing 60% above the speed limit, considering such low limits are normally in force around schools (or around Tower Bridge for example), the driver could be looking at more than £60 and 3 points if located and brought before the beak.

[tartan_rob]

Meant to add:
1) Never, under any circumstances, view the photo on the web prior to issuing your plead. By accessing the picture, they note it was accessed and I'm sure they trap your IP address - but in any case it is restricted access only to those photo's and they can identify if you have viewed it and then said, nope it wasn't me, even though you can be seen on the photo.

2) If caught speeding by a traffic car, apart from ensuring they loose sight of you at some stage during the pursuit, when you get into their car and they caution you and say "do you understand?", You reply with "No". They repeat the sentence, you repeat as before and ask for a copy of PACE (Police and Criminal Evidence act) to read, you need detailed clarification. By law they must get this to you, they are unlikely to have a copy of it in the car, so they need to call the base to have a copy brought to you as you refuse to goto the station. PACE is a LARGE book (250 odd pages) and by law you are entitled to read it in its entirity even if it takes you 48 hours, they cannot pass you onto another copper to continue to deal with it. They have to remain with you. You must keep reading slowly, then they will have to provide drinks etc for you. Make it desperately uncomfortable for them. And remember, this is perfectly legal.

The other thing is, when they say "anything you say will be written down and used as evidence", your response should be "please don't hit me again officer!", or "no, I will not admit this in order that you get away for food soon!"....words to that effect.....