I'm stupid

Post by **Jarv** » Mon May 21, 2007 9:23 pm

I'll qualify that. I left the courtesy light on when I parked up at work this morning and then, when it was as dead as a dead thing after work, I tried jumping it by connecting the leads to the wrong terminals. In my defence, it was dark in the underground car park and the Jag I was jumping it off had red tape around the negative battery terminal.

Anyway, got it going but now have a problem with the top section of the DIS in that nothing displays there (CD track listing for phatbox or road name if using the navigation system), but when I turn ignition on, I get the amber 'OK', so I know the display works.

The navigation system works fine, except TMC. I get this message when I turn the radio on:

'RDS-TMC Tuner: Connection to RDS-TMC Tuner is faulty or could not be established'

I've ran VAGCOM over it and got a few errors. I'm not that knowledgeable with VAGCOM, but this may be relevant:

Address 17: Instruments Labels: 8Dx-920-9xx-17.LBL
Part No: 8D0 920 981
Component: B5-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D13
Coding: 00464
Shop #: WSC 00618
WUAZZZ8DZ1N902350 AUZ7Z0Y1627704

2 Faults Found:
01300 - Control Module for Navigation with CD-Rom (J401)
49-00 - No Communications
01304 - Radio
49-00 - No Communications

I thought the above might have something to do with the phatbox installation which plugs into the CD feed so may be a red herring, but I'm not sure.

Any advice would be welcome.

Cheers.

Post by **Dippy** » Tue May 22, 2007 12:50 pm

Well it's definitely something to do with your TMC/CAN gateway. Try checking the configuration with VAG-COM.

Post by **Jarv** » Tue May 22, 2007 3:37 pm

Thanks for that Dippy. Like I said in my thread, I'm not hugely comfortable with VAGCOM yet. I have the full version, so If you or anyone can give me some tips on how to narrow down what I need to test using VAGCOM then that would be really helpful.

Post by **Dippy** » Tue May 22, 2007 4:51 pm

Take a look here: http://www.nav-plus.com/instructions/programming.html

Post by **Jarv** » Tue May 22, 2007 5:03 pm

Top man, I'll have a good read of that later.

Post by **Jarv** » Tue May 22, 2007 10:41 pm

I hooked up the VAGCom this evening and have learnt a bit more about how it works, which is nice. For some reason the tyre size was set to 195/65 R15, so I set that to 255/35 R18, but that doesn't help my CANbus / DIS issue.

The only related problem I could see was under module 37-Navigation measuring blocks, block 4 states 'Not OK', which means that car is not communicating with the instrument cluster (apparently only works if you have TMC/CAN).

The other thing that I noted was that if I clicked on module 19-CAN Gateway I got a 'No Response from Controller!' message.

Maybe I should be posting this on the VAGCom thread.

Can anyone tell me what this CAN Gateway or CANBus controller is, what it does, can it be replaced, does it have a fuse that might have blown or a dodgy connection that I can check?

Advice greatfully received (as ever!).

Post by **shineydave** » Tue May 22, 2007 11:04 pm

did you try to clear the fault codes, i had some very strange issues with the wifes passat after i changed the battery which cured themselves after i cleared the codes

Post by **Jarv** » Wed May 23, 2007 10:16 pm

Hi Dave,

Well, yes, I cleared these codes from the instrument module (17):

3 Faults Found:
01300 - Control Module for Navigation with CD-Rom (J401)
49-00 - No Communications
01304 - Radio
49-00 - No Communications
01311 - Information Data Bus
37-10 - Faulty - Intermittent

But got these one's back:

2 Faults Found:
01300 - Control Module for Navigation with CD-Rom (J401)
49-00 - No Communications
01304 - Radio
49-00 - No Communications

And as I said in a previous post, it's not letting me into the CAN gateway module (19), so I can't clear any codes there.

I did a search on here last night and came up with a member who had the same problem, and he disconnected his battery overnight and it corrected itself. I did this last night and it didn't.

I'm thinking that it is some sort of coding issue, but I don't know what, it's just a feeling. I'm considering handing her over to my local dealer to look at, which has got to hurt.

Post by **Dippy** » Fri May 25, 2007 1:42 pm

TMC/CAN is indeed a dual function device. It receives the traffic signals and it also converts the serial bus of the SatNav+ to the format that the DIS understands.

I have never got as response from my CAN gateway with VAG-COM, yet mine works so I don't think it is that.

Unfortunately the only circuit schematics I have are from my Bentley CD which only covers US cars and they never got SatNav+. I'm sure the TMC is fused, however it will likely share one so if the fuse had gone I'd guess you'd see other equipment out too. If yours is a factory fit, the TMC is mounted on a bracket just to the left and below the steering wheen column. If you remove the knee bolster (4 screws two behind the fuse panel) you can get to it. Check the wiring because the fault code -

01311 - Information Data Bus
37-10 - Faulty - Intermittent

- suggests maybe a problem there.

If the unit is gone then you can try a replacement, but you'd need the right variant. They are bound to be expensive new and maybe hard to find (even on www.ebay.de). I think I got mine for about £50 but was lucky as they used to got for twice that. And what if you got one and it still didn't solve the problem?

Im in a similar position to you. My multifunction steering wheel controls are intermittent. I have tried to get a replacement on e-bay but I can't find the right variant. A new one will cost me about £150. But I don't KNOW that it is at fault. It could be the control module in the steering wheel or the SatNav+ head itself. Unfortunately I can't afford to fault-find as I seem to have another problem (probably the instrument cluster) which drains the battery after only an hour or so. So I have no choice but to pass the problem over to my Audi dealer.

In your case all I can suggest is to fault-find the wiring. If the unit is powered then really you'd need a scope to see if there are signals coming from the SatNav+ head but not getting to the other side of the TMC.

Post by **Jarv** » Fri May 25, 2007 8:25 pm

Hi Dippy,

That's really useful info, thanks for taking the time to post it. I'll take the knee bolster off tomorrow and check out the tmc unit. I did call VAGParts the other day to get a ball-park on this unit and it was around £250, so, as you say, it's not the sort of thing you want to replace unless you know it's faulty.

I did give the car to my local mechanic just to see if he could see what the problem was. He knows a bit about diagnostics, but couldn't find the problem. what he did say was that the nav unit may have been replaced at some point and when the battery went flat all the settings went back to factory, but as the unit is not the same one that was originally installed the coding is wrong. I don't know whether there's something in that or not.

I also called my local dealer, and the guy seemed to know what he was talking about, and he reckoned that they could either fix it or ascertain what the problem was within an hour, but that would be £150 inclusive. I said I'd get back to him.

I am going to take the car up to APS for a 4 wheel alignment, and I know their hourly rate is pretty reasonable, but I don't know whether they have the expertise in this area. I'll call them and find out.

I'll post an update on here when I have one.

And good luck with your issue Dippy.

Post by **Jarv** » Wed May 30, 2007 9:55 pm

So, car went into dealers this morning at 8 am for a 1 hour diagnosis, and it's still there. The resident expert was otherwise engaged, not a problem for me though, I said keep it until he can look at it. Had an interesting discussion with the lady on reception when I dropped it off, I don't think she dealt with X reg cars that often. She asked if it was a private plate and then if it was an import, she then worked out it was 6 years old and, she carefully pointed out to me, it was out of warranty and I would have to pay for the work. Thanks for that.

Anyway, the expert called me late in the day and said that the battery was not heavy duty enough and that it wasn't taking a full charge, and that they could replace it and do another charge test all for £250 odd. I kindly declined that one.

Then on to my TMC issue. He said that he could find no records that the CD based navigation system was ever fitted as an option on the RS4 B5 and so had no data on which to test the equipment. He said that the system that was offered as an option on my car was the DVD based system. He then asked me if the TMC function ever worked on the car. Err, yes, it worked right up to the point when the battery went flat last week. Pre flat battery, TMC, ITIS, tailback, direction info and phatbox tracks on the DIS all worked fine. I also told him that, as far as I was aware, the RNS-D CD based Navigation Plus system was an option and mine was fitted from new.

He said that he would keep the car in and have another look at it in the morning.

Will someone please tell me I'm not going mad and that I am correct in saying that the CD based RNS-D Nav Plus unit was the option offered on the RS4 B5.

I've always kept an open mind about the service which dealerships provide, but I've got to say that after the conversation that I had with the 'expert', I'm not filled with confidence.

Post by **RSVI** » Wed May 30, 2007 11:58 pm

Jarv wrote:Had an interesting discussion with the lady on reception
I don't think she dealt with X reg cars that often
She asked if it was a private plate
she then worked out it was 6 years old
pointed out to me.... out of warranty.......would have to pay.....

Sorry to hijack thread but i just PMSL. They're great some receptionists

And to get back onto topic, you guys are just too clever with all the VAG talk, I'd love to know what you're talking about

Post by **Dippy** » Thu May 31, 2007 4:51 pm

Correct, the B5 only ever had the RNS-D as an option. The RNS-E only started with the B6. The codes in your service book show factory-fitted equipment, plus dealers can find out from your VIN.

Personally I wouldn't be too hard on him. He has to work on all the models and all the different chassis, so he can't be expected to know this, although not having tried to confirm it from your car's details seems odd.

BTW the RS4 does need a high capacity battery.

Post by **craigyb** » Thu May 31, 2007 5:05 pm

What a muppet, the techy guy, not you. And as for that receptionist, oh my god....

Post by **shineydave** » Thu May 31, 2007 5:57 pm

01300 - Control Module for Navigation with CD-Rom (J401)

is this not a code refering to the boot mounted cd changer based system and not the nav-plus system?

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