M3 vrs S4

[TurkS4]

Had a little flirt with a old M3(98)...

Saw him in front of me on a dual carraige way and followed him until we came to a roundabout. He floored it as we were levelling off to carry onto another dual carraige way and I followed swiftly in second gear about 1 car length behind. He had to slow down due to a slower car in front, and by this time we were doing around 60mph when the slower car moved over and he floored it again. I was already in third gear and just stuck with it until the red line, still a car length behind. I could see him change up a gear as the car lost some speed, whereby I then changed up to fourth. It was at this point I was inching closer to him. I moved over to the inside lane and was slowly inching up level to his rear when I had to move back in behind due to a car in front of me. By this time we approached a large roundabout, both braking and I'm a car length behind (thought i'd let him go into the corner quicker than me). I go into this roundabout in third gear doing around 60mph (still a car length behind) when his rear end starts to step out, which he straightens out (nice driving [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]), but when he puts the power down once more his back end slides big time (controlled it well again [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]). It was at this point we ahd to go our seperate ways, but I was easily cornering better and faster than him as I had to let off when I saw his rear stepping out, but still retained 1 car length and am quite sure I would have out done him on this roundabout.

I've heard a lot of comments how the M3 is a better handling car, but what I saw and confirm is that my S4 out cornered this M3.

Question: If I was chipped would I have moved past him in third gear or would this have been more realistic in fourth gear and how may car lengths would I have pulled on him.

Cheers..... [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]

[Carps]

Question: If I was chipped would I have moved past him in third gear or would this have been more realistic in fourth gear and how may car lengths would I have pulled on him.

In the post about the rolling road meet is says you have Revo and various other toys...

S4
TurkS4 x 2 (Revo Remap, Forge DVs, and Tanoga SS)

What is the difference between the Revo remap (which I understand you can dial in to your own settings) and a chipping ? I thought they both did essentially the same job - albiet through a different means [img]images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] I'd be interested to hear how the two compare, as the Revo seems a great idea to me.

Cheers

[PhilT]

S4
TurkS4 x 2 (Revo Remap, Forge DVs, and Tanoga SS)

Post Saturday the 31st, currently stock.

[TurkS4]

PhilT...boy you're quick!!!.

carps...Philt is right, currently stock, but on the 31st may I am going to have a short shifter [img]images/graemlins/033102bigblink_1_prv.gif[/img][img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img] and a 5 hour Revo trial. Not too sure about the DV's though as want to give the Revo a go first and then decide when the legal issues are clarified.

The difference as i understand, is that chipping or remap is by means of soldering a modified chip onto your ECU. In the case of Revo, there is no need to solder anything onto your ECU, as this is done by re-programming your ECU to thinks its the muts nuts. You also has various options with revo on boost/Torque settings etc

With the Revo way, you can re-program your ECU back to stock so when you take it in for a service or claim under warranty, and the dealer is none the wiser....or for insurance claims etc [img]images/graemlins/sekret.gif[/img]

There are a few techy types on this board who could probably give you chapter and verse on the difference.

[Riz_RS4]

There are a few techy types on this board who could probably give you chapter and verse on the difference.

After taking the 5 hour trial myself there is no chapter and verse........ its the dogs nads.... and with high boost its the dogs nads plus the puppies! [img]images/graemlins/jump.gif[/img]

[Carps]

How much does a revo system set you back ? I like the look of the one that incorporates immobilization - seems like a cool extra feature, and perhaps the insurance companies would like it a bit more [img]images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Let us know how you get on with it. And you won't regret the shortshifter. A couple of days with it and every other car you drive will feel wierd !

[Riz_RS4]

How much does a revo system set you back ? I like the look of the one that incorporates immobilization - seems like a cool extra feature, and perhaps the insurance companies would like it a bit more

Part No. Description RRP
SPS1 SPS 1 (STOCK & SWITCHING ONLY) 149
SPS2 SPS 2 (STK, 2 X PERF+ANTI-THEFT) 199
SPS3 SPS 3 (SWITCHING + BOOST/IGN.CONT) 249

For the initial application its 499 for the S3 (think its same for all cars)

So for a complete system i would get the application and SPS3=
£748 plus VAT 17.5% = TOTAL £878.90

[TurkS4]

Carps.....I expect it to be cheaper than some other tuning companys as they do not RR your car. I'll ask Mitch on the 31st and let you know [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]

This link gives you the breakdown on what it does..

http://www.fontain.co.uk/performance-tu ... u-revo.asp

[Riz_RS4]

Chaps, im going to be putting foward the request for the possibility of a group buy for RS246.com members and see what kind of discount he can do if he agrees! [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]

[TurkS4]

Sounds like a plan Riz...let us know what the numbers look like [img]images/graemlins/thumbs.gif[/img]

[Riz_RS4]

see REVO Groupbuy post! [img]images/graemlins/boots.gif[/img]

[DavidT]

Guys,

I would recommend you inform your insurers about any and all mods.

I was talking to a tuner a couple of weeks ago whose organisation had been approached by an insurance company who wanted them to inspect accident damaged cars for evidence of modifications. He described it as poacher turned gatekeeper and refused, obviously but he felt they would have plenty of takers at the rates offered.

The insurers are prepared to invest in things that will allow them to refuse claims.

[DuncS3]

I've heard a lot of comments how the M3 is a better handling car, but what I saw and confirm is that my S4 out cornered this M3

Turk - the E46 M3 (current shape) is the one that is meant to be the dogs - the older E36 was not always rated that highly in motoring mags

Dunc [img]images/graemlins/s3addict.gif[/img]

[Dippy]

There are a few techy types on this board who could probably give you chapter and verse on the difference.

Your explanation is 99% there, although 'chipping' does not necessarily mean soldering.

The reason for the word chipping is that the ECU contains devices officially called "integrated circuits", but unofficially called "chips" (for the life of me I can't remember why - it's ages since I was a practising electronics engineer). There are chips in everything these days from radios to space shuttles.

Since there is a chip in the ECU which contains the 'mapping' for the engine (a map is an N-dimensional look-up table), in order to change performance, a 'remap' is needed, so the chip must be modified. The process of modification is termed "chipping".

How it's actually done depends on both the ECU type and the tuner's methods, however there are broadly 3:
1) Removing the existing chip and either reprogramming it or putting a new one in. For most ECUs this would require re-soldering (as any ECU whose chips are not soldered in could be unreliable).
2) Adding another chip/module to the ECU (termed 'piggy-backing'). This may or may not require soldering.
3) Reprogramming the ECU 'in-situ', if the ECU was designed with this facility. A lot of VAG cars have this facility, and it is what Revo have taken advantage of.

In terms of performance, the method used is irrelevant, as it's the design of the 'remap' that governs the performance.

Clearly the Revo has some advantages in terms of ease and time of reprogramming, adding extra features, and transparency. Of course the latter is only really useful for those who want to commit fraud.

Regarding the Revo map, the dyno plots I've seen so far suggest that Revo program for higher boost than their competitors.

Higher boost means more torque/power, but in all probability, also a shorter engine life (you don't get something for nothing in this game...)