Company Car Issue

[Cabar Feidh]

Hi folks

The company I work for has just went through a Sell Out and Merger. It was an independently owned American company supplying to the oil industry and was bought by a bigger American company who already owned one of our competitors and the 2 of us have merged to become 1 company. In my job grade under the old company, I got a company car allowance and the only stipulation was that the car had 4 doors and was in and kept in good order, maintained, insured etc. Our competitor gave the same job grade company cars but they were restricted to Renault Meganes, 1.6 diesel with the tracking chips in them! Needless to say i was totally hacked off at the thought of losing my allowance and having a Megane in its place.

In my job I hardly do any business miles, probably 250 a year if that - based in the customers office and go to the occasional meeting at our own office (1 mile away), other external meetings or training or customer entertainment. They have now said we can keep the car allowance but as it will be be a company sponsored vehicle I have to get the chip installed in the RS4 and which must be working all the time not just on business mileage. Even worse than having the Megane! Chips are downloaded monthly and report speed (knows where you are so knows speeed limit), acceleration and deceleration. Whereabouts isnt reported but i'm sure its logged and available if required.

At my recent appraisal, I suggested that having the chip monitoring me on my private mileage was against my human rights but the response was - "if you are the sort of person who doesnt want to drive safely, are you the sort of person we want to employ". I didnt respond as im pretty sure I wouldnt have needed to worry about company cars/allowance if I had!!

The only way this isnt going to cost me money is if they allow me to take chip out when on private mileage which I cant see happening. Take the company car, I lose my allowance or buy a second car to sit in the office car park for use on business mileage - costs of that ie loss on depreciation, road tax, insurance with no NCB etc etc. I'm single so cant fob the company/second car on to the wife/partner!!

Has anyone any knowledge of a way round this or any loopholes/legislation which can help? Anything would be much appreciated.


Thanks

Mike

[S4WON]

Wow, just wow.

On the response to your appraisal alone, I'd be looking already. This isn't going to end well, get rid of the motor and find another firm is my advice

[barryrs]

You could get something really crap on a lease deal and put the tracker on that

A used 2012 Peugeot 107 1.0 could be had for £299 deposit and circa £60 per month and £20 a year road tax. That will be like saying good bye to around a grand of your car allowance a year though.

[adsgreen]

Practical measures.
#1 these types of trackers are not rocket science. Simply +12v, -12v and switched 12v. It wouldn't be... "difficult" to make it shall we say... portable.
#2 if not needing to go portable then most systems do not log if the switched wire is not active (hibernation mode)... snip or switch
#3 most systems have a privacy mode. not perfect but a compromise.
#4 a scooter would also be able to cope with the system

how long have you been with the company?

hassle hr - you are looking for the privacy policies and data retention, security management, access etc.

I have seen somebody buy a shed and sell within a week - the company have to pay for removal and "making good". after a couple months of this the matter was quietly dropped.

Don't go for a jammer as can land you in bother with the authorities.


There is Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights that specifically mentions the right to privacy.

[John@mk]

don't know to much about these chip / black boxes but was talking to a guy who's son had one fitted to his car and when the Dad used the car for a couple of days said even when driving to the speed limit and slowing down through the gears plus a total miss Daisy still could not meet their recommended driving style.this black box for the son's car insurance.
maybe time to opt out of the company scheme .......

[Cabar Feidh]

Thanks for the replies.

I've been doing a bit of digging in the internet but cant find anything for my situation as the general idea is that having a company car or allowance means you do a lot of miles whereas i dont. I did find some advice to someone that monitoring of private driving couldnt be justified but that wouldnt stop them doing it but just that they couldnt use it officially. The company's stance on this is that they want people to drive safely at all times not just when on company business. My colleague who works with me at the same customer came from the other side of the merger and he has a Megane with chip - he doesnt get 100% compliance every month on acceleration and decceleration driving that thing and he commutes through the centre of town every day so sits in traffic most of the time. Every time you touch the accelerator in the RS would probably get a bleep!

Ive been with the company coming up to 8 years but truth be told i'm not exactly thrilled with the new merged company anyway so a change could well be on the cards. Thing is i enjoy the job I'm doing in the customers office (oil company) which isnt strictly the job I should be doing but rather what they want us to do! There is the possibility they could only take me on if their own guy leaves or moves to another role and thats unlikely at the moment. Its a small sector of the oil insudtry I work in so theres not that many opportunities out there except for the less desirable frontiers in the oil game eg Iraq, West Africa!

The options are company car or company car allowance with chip in my car or a second car. No option to opt out - I'd be happy enough to take the allowance and not be reimbursed for any business mileage ie the 45p/mile I could claim!

Current thinking now is that I get the chip in the RS and just "forget" to put it in when doing private mileage and see what they do! I very much doubt they could sack me - I think I would have a fair chance of a claim for unfair dismissal.


Cheers

Mike

[adsgreen]

so what exactly are they proposing to do should you be deemed to be driving "unsafe" out of office hours?

[Cabar Feidh]

As the report doesnt and cant differentiate between private and business mileage I assume I would come under the same disciplinary proceedings as if it were business use. According to my colleague it could end in a sacking if I ignore the warnings.

This is his latest report - mostly commuting and some business miles in a Megane 1.6 diesel in town traffic. I imagine it would be pretty easy to get into the yellow or even the red driving the RS "normally" let alone as its intended to be driven! I commute over back B roads and only sit in traffic for the last mile and that also includes crossing and joining the A90 dual carriage way where I have to normally stop in central reservation - so thats at least 2 hard accelarations and 1 decceleration per day alone. This is who they use - http://www.driveright.co.uk

[Nobby]

Haven't got a clue about the car/chip issues, but shouldn't the terms and conditions of the merger come under TUPE rules - entitling you to the same T&Cs as you did before under the old employer?

[Nobby]

Edit - you could also check out ACAS for advice.

[adsgreen]

ok - so how do you deal with other people driving your car?
Lets say for example, your wife is deemed to drive "unsafe" are they seriously saying that your wife driving your car would lead to you losing your job?

Also ask them how they deal with off road events such as fully legal and insured trackdays and time trials.

Looking through the specs its really basic. the gps isn't looking to be used for speed details but just positioning.

Also as you say, this has no business mileage separation so is of pointless accounting use - you would still need to manually submit mileage claims.

Other options - if the car is leased then it's not yours and the owner may so no.

Similarly, warranty and other items specifically state NO modifications to the standard specification. Insurance can work this way too.

I would ask what data is stored, for how long, who has access to the data, what are the criteria for disciplinary actions and what actions would be taken.

I could understand you driving like a tit in their car - it's theirs after all but the rest is b/s.

[adsgreen]

Haven't got a clue about the car/chip issues, but shouldn't the terms and conditions of the merger come under TUPE rules - entitling you to the same T&Cs as you did before under the old employer?

+1

however the new employer can change the rules to a degree.

[HYFR]

Do you work for the Nazi party?

[Silverfox42]

Someone up the food chain (HR or Accounts) has had a bad experience and now wants everyone to suffer from their indiscretions.
If you only do 250 miles on business, purchase a road bike or scooter and fit it to that. Stick that (or the black box thingy) in your car when the weather is sh1te.

Check your original contracts and addendum's on allowance policy, these are what you signed up for and cannot be changed without consent under EU Law.

Or as for a pay rise more than or equal to your annual car allowance. They are no worse off, you are not under the spotlight, justify it by saying you are doing a hybrid role and that the customer is likely to cancel its contract/go elsewhere if you are not retained… Just an idea. I hate big corp boll0x like that.

[RSoul]

My neighbour cycles to paraDYCE everyday you want me to gaffer tape it to his grifter???