B8 RS4 – Test 3rd gear 3000-8000rpm times

[Surrey Sam]

Ok, so those who've come from the earlier B7 RS4s might have heard about doing this test before; sometimes referred to as the Arthur Test, after a forum member. If not, read on.

The thinking behind it was to establish an easy method, where a user can gauge a cars health/fitness. Without having to resort to utilising a Rolling Road Dyno and all the pitfalls they can bring. The more people who carry out the test and share information within the thread, helps the database and users to understand what is good and what is not so good.

So to carry out the test, you must find a suitable piece of Tarmac. Doing this test will take you from 30mph to just shy of 100mph, so please bare that in mind and be sensible. Roads... sorry, I mean private airfields which are not flat. Will affect the times + or - by 2 tenths depending on the incline or decline, as will the altitude of where you carry out this test and that could vary up to one second from a sea level +500ft time.

The car must be in Manual mode, so that 3rd gear can be kept locked in. Get your lap timer up on the driver display, use the button on the underside of the right hand stalk. The rocker button on the end of that stalk will start (top) and stop (bottom) the stopwatch. To reset the time/split, just press and hold the underside button. For those not comfortable operating the car and doing this, then you could just film it and do the timing once back home. So once you're all set and ready to go, drive the car up to 20-25 mph and select 3rd in manual, roll onto the throttle and then pin it. Watch the rpm climb and when it hits 3000rpm click the top of the rocker button and begin timing, press the bottom of the rocker to stop the stopwatch once the car hits 8000rpm. Remember to lift off the throttle or select another gear, as you'll quickly hit the limiter and it will continue bouncing off it, with the car being in manual gear selection. You won't over rev the engine though, so don't worry if you do happen to snag the limiter.

To recap:

• Lap timer screen ready

• Manual mode - 3rd gear

• Start timing at 3000rpm

• Finish timing at 8000rpm

• Repeat a few times, to gain a reasonable average

• Post results here with info on your car and conditions.

With the use of VCDS measuring intake temps at the manifold, I found that heat soaking can really affect times too. So if I for example sat in a layby waiting for a gap, sorry I mean end of a runway with the car idling for 5 mins. I would see those intake manifold temps raise by up to 40 centigrade, that would increase the 3000-8000rpm times by a second. For those interested, inlet manifold air temps would only get to ambient temperature +10 degrees centigrade, and that was after good stints at Autobahn speeds. Depending on how badly heat soaked your manifold was, it can take up to 3 or 4 miles at motorway speeds to bring them back down.

Onto results then, I hear you say .

Well the caveat here is that I recently had a very low rolling road result - 345 BHP. So I potentially have an underlying issue (vacuum leak/carbon build up), hence testing and data logging. But it's a starting point for these tests. Please don't think you have to go to the lengths I have, just time a few pulls and report back.


Results.

Car:
2014 - RS4 Avant
Mileage - 34k (new engine at 17k)
Fuel Level - 30-40% tank of fuel
Fuel Type - Tesco Momentum 99 SUL
External Temp - 10 centigrade
Road condition - Flat road, around 100ft above sea level
Load - Driver only
Carbon clean? - Never

Mods:
Akrapovic exhaust system - centre section and back boxes.
ITG drop in air filters.

Times:
Five runs were done under optimum conditions - 7.8, 7.9, 8.0, 7.8, 7.8, Average = 7.86 secs

Others
58C heat soaked intake = 8.8
46C heat soaked intake = 8.6
35C heat soaked intake = 8.2
20C intake temp, optimum for air temp (10C) = 7.8

So please log away and share here

Cheers
Sam

[Surrey Sam]

Reserved for future use.

[Thundercliffe81]

Ok, so those who've come from the earlier B7 RS4s might have heard about doing this test before; sometimes referred to as the Arthur Test, after a forum member. If not, read on.

The thinking behind it was to establish an easy method, where a user can gauge a cars health/fitness. Without having to resort to utilising a Rolling Road Dyno and all the pitfalls they can bring. The more people who carry out the test and share information within the thread, helps the database and users to understand what is good and what is not so good.

So to carry out the test, you must find a suitable piece of Tarmac. Doing this test will take you from 30mph to just shy of 100mph, so please bare that in mind and be sensible. Roads... sorry, I mean private airfields which are not flat. Will affect the times + or - by 2 tenths depending on the incline or decline, as will the altitude of where you carry out this test and that could vary up to one second from a sea level +500ft time.

The car must be in Manual mode, so that 3rd gear can be kept locked in. Get your lap timer up on the driver display, use the button on the underside of the right hand stalk. The rocker button on the end of that stalk will start (top) and stop (bottom) the stopwatch. To reset the time/split, just press and hold the underside button. For those not comfortable operating the car and doing this, then you could just film it and do the timing once back home. So once you're all set and ready to go, drive the car up to 20-25 mph and select 3rd in manual, roll onto the throttle and then pin it. Watch the rpm climb and when it hits 3000rpm click the top of the rocker button and begin timing, press the bottom of the rocker to stop the stopwatch once the car hits 8000rpm. Remember to lift off the throttle or select another gear, as you'll quickly hit the limiter and it will continue bouncing off it, with the car being in manual gear selection. You won't over rev the engine though, so don't worry if you do happen to snag the limiter.

To recap:

• Lap timer screen ready

• Manual mode - 3rd gear

• Start timing at 3000rpm

• Finish timing at 8000rpm

• Repeat a few times, to gain a reasonable average

• Post results here with info on your car and conditions.

With the use of VCDS measuring intake temps at the manifold, I found that heat soaking can really affect times too. So if I for example sat in a layby waiting for a gap, sorry I mean end of a runway with the car idling for 5 mins. I would see those intake manifold temps raise by up to 40 centigrade, that would increase the 3000-8000rpm times by a second. For those interested, inlet manifold air temps would only get to ambient temperature +10 degrees centigrade, and that was after good stints at Autobahn speeds. Depending on how badly heat soaked your manifold was, it can take up to 3 or 4 miles at motorway speeds to bring them back down.

Onto results then, I hear you say .

Well the caveat here is that I recently had a very low rolling road result - 345 BHP. So I potentially have an underlying issue (vacuum leak/carbon build up), hence testing and data logging. But it's a starting point for these tests. Please don't think you have to go to the lengths I have, just time a few pulls and report back.


Results.

Car:
2014 - RS4 Avant
Mileage - 34k (new engine at 17k)
Fuel Level - 30-40% tank of fuel
Fuel Type - Tesco Momentum 99 SUL
External Temp - 10 centigrade
Road condition - Flat road, around 100ft above sea level
Load - Driver only
Carbon clean? - Never

Mods:
Akrapovic exhaust system - centre section and back boxes.
ITG drop in air filters.

Times:
Five runs were done under optimum conditions - 7.8, 7.9, 8.0, 7.8, 7.8, Average = 7.86 secs

Others
58C heat soaked intake = 8.8
46C heat soaked intake = 8.6
35C heat soaked intake = 8.2
20C intake temp, optimum for air temp (10C) = 7.8

So please log away and share here

Cheers
Sam

Certainly shall Sam. When my brakes are sorted. Just in case. Should be this week. Recently had health check at CM Tuning. No dyno available there but some a few pulls recording the data. 3 cylinders have minor lag up at about 7k rpm but very minor and car performing well apparently. We'll see after your test.

Incidentally, can you predict power output from whatever average time we get?


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[Sammyb349]

Sam - would be worth noting ambient temperature (approx) and whether summer or winter tyres are being used. Some will have winters on ATM.

Will try and get to results this week.
Sam

[Thundercliffe81]

Sam - would be worth noting ambient temperature (approx) and whether summer or winter tyres are being used. Some will have winters on ATM.

Will try and get to results this week.
Sam

Winters...good point. Bugger. Haha.


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[Surrey Sam]

Certainly shall Sam. When my brakes are sorted. Just in case. Should be this week. Recently had health check at CM Tuning. No dyno available there but some a few pulls recording the data. 3 cylinders have minor lag up at about 7k rpm but very minor and car performing well apparently. We'll see after your test.

Incidentally, can you predict power output from whatever average time we get?

Did the garage mention anything further about the lag, like if it was timing or fuel trims? Just interested.

With the previous generation there was a lot of input in the end, so you could roughly ball park the power output based from the times achieved within say 10-20BHP. But as people were getting rolling road figures with their freshly de-coked engines it helped.

Another way is to data log airflow through the throttle body (I've been doing this too). With VCDS logging IDE 03711 it will show airflow in kg/h. Pull some WOT runs in 3rd and see what figures you are getting between 7000-8000 RPM - disregard any odd figures, I had one of 1200. Mine averaged out at 1065 kg/h, divide by 3.6 to get the g/s figure and divide again by 0.8 to get approx HP. For me 370BHP, the recent dyno was 345BHP but that was heavily heat soaked and can't provide the quantities of air, like driving at near 100mph can.

I'm sure there is more complexity to it all and figures should be used to gauge health rather than, this is what the car makes.

Sam - would be worth noting ambient temperature (approx) and whether summer or winter tyres are being used. Some will have winters on ATM.

Will try and get to results this week.
Sam

That'd be cool if you could

I did note the external air temp in my report (was 10C outside). I don't know if winter tyres would really affect timings? They have lower rated speed limits, but you shouldn't exceed those with this test.

[marc1]

Sam your car can’t be only putting out those figures. Does it feel slower than it was? That test you are doing in VCDS sounds similar to logging the MAF readings. Is it worth doing that too? I think it was measuring block 003 on the B7 but I’ve slept a lot since

Wonder if you’ve got a vac leak somewhere?

[Sammyb349]

That'd be cool if you could

I did note the external air temp in my report (was 10C outside). I don't know if winter tyres would really affect timings? They have lower rated speed limits, but you shouldn't exceed those with this test.

I imagine it must do and be ambient temp dependent as winter tyres are designed to out perform traction wise below ~7c and consequently underperforms above ~12c.

I suppose the more variables that are the same the better the comparisons will be

[Surrey Sam]

Sam your car can’t be only putting out those figures. Does it feel slower than it was? That test you are doing in VCDS sounds similar to logging the MAF readings. Is it worth doing that too? I think it was measuring block 003 on the B7 but I’ve slept a lot since

Wonder if you’ve got a vac leak somewhere?

I was expecting lower figures, just not THAT low!!! The new engine was super tight when running it in and after that period, it never quite had the zing my original engine had at the top end, say 5000+rpm. The dyno graph curve kinda supports that, even if you ignore the numbers. AFR figures were spot on too.

Graph for anyone interested, click image to enlarge:

Surrey Rolling Road - Dyno result

Yes, the test is just like what we would do for the B7's. How we go about it, is just slightly different now as the ECU technology has changed. But the engines are very similar hence what works for one generation, should be ok for another within reason.

I'm doing all this data collecting, so that I have a suspected 'unhealthy' baseline. Once done. I shall do some Vacuum tests, pull the inlet manifold for inspection and check PCV for operation/oil build up. The engine ancillaries’ are all original and got swapped over to the new engine; so my manifold/flaps could have some coking - as that's done 34k miles now. At this stage my thinking is to also send off the injectors for flow analysis and whilst there, replace the injector filter baskets with metal versions. Potentially those are a weak point and can fail on performance Audi/VAG models. Finally re-test and see where we're at

[Surrey Sam]

I imagine it must do and be ambient temp dependent as winter tyres are designed to out perform traction wise below ~7c and consequently underperforms above ~12c.

I suppose the more variables that are the same the better the comparisons will be

Absolutely agree on the winter tyre temps from my own experience. And yes keeping the variables to a minimum with reason, will only help to keep the data to a higher standard. But we have to be realistic as well.

However with this test being 3rd gear, it should not have any traction issues under good dry conditions. Unless someone is running on Chinese Nankang ditch finder remould tyres, or has a crazy Turbo or Supercharger setup. But even then, the B7 RS4 Supercharged guys who are around the 600BHP area, had no problems carrying out the 3rd gear 3000-8000rpm test

[mdrs4_82]

*Edit*

Year: 2014
Fuel: 40%
Surface: Flat (no perceivable incline/decline)
Temp: 6.5 degrees C
Carbon clean: No
Miles: ~42k
Load: Just driver
Mods: Capristo centre-back
Timing: post-editing video (very used to doing 60-100 on many cars and this method is accurate)

Run 1: 7.6s
Run 2: 7.4s

Only 2 runs I'm afraid, average = 7.5s. The runs were done in opposite directions but on the same bit of tarmac.


Incidentally, I captured 4th as well and 60-100 time comes in at around 5.4s which tallies up with the figures here: http://accelerationtimes.com/models/audi-rs4-avant-2012

(Not sure where this data was obtained from).

I'm sure it could do 60-100 a little quicker if I started in 2nd, given that it is a dual clutch.

5.4s is reasonably quick, not the quickest I've owned though. Best time I've had is 4.9s in my old 370bhp Volvo S40 T4