Hubcentric wheel spacers are they safe?

[lengster1]

Im looking to fit these to the RS4 8mm front 10 mm rear,However from searching the web photos would appear that hubcentric means that they locate the hub centrally but do not locate the wheel,sure they have a tapered flange that will sit inside the wheel but unless that snugly fits the taper on the inside of the wheel it will not locate the wheel in a central position before bolting up NOR will it take any of the shear loading!! In effect you are using the wheel bolts to do both "GULP" on a heavy 400bhp car im not sure this is a good idea!!!!!!! Any thoughts would be much appreciated or suppliers of spacers that do have a central location spigot like when std.Bearing in mind that replacement longer bolts are usually crappy cast ones and your asking them to not just nip the wheel but take the shear lading aswell i would be very carefull

[UNI555]

Not true, the spigot on the spacer locates accurately into the wheel in the same way that the hub would, the ones I used would actually stay in place on the wheel if you lay the wheel on it's back (I tried it). The bolts should be TUV approved and of the same quality as the originals, if not don't use them.

[BlingBling]

Im looking to fit these to the RS4 8mm front 10 mm rear,However from searching the web photos would appear that hubcentric means that they locate the hub centrally but do not locate the wheel,sure they have a tapered flange that will sit inside the wheel but unless that snugly fits the taper on the inside of the wheel it will not locate the wheel in a central position before bolting up NOR will it take any of the shear loading!! In effect you are using the wheel bolts to do both "GULP" on a heavy 400bhp car im not sure this is a good idea!!!!!!! Any thoughts would be much appreciated or suppliers of spacers that do have a central location spigot like when std.Bearing in mind that replacement longer bolts are usually crappy cast ones and your asking them to not just nip the wheel but take the shear lading aswell i would be very carefull

Your too paranoid. H&R spacers are made bya German company. Germans generally leave nothing in doubt. As pointed out they will conform to TÃœV.

Fitting spacers will apply extra loads on the bearings. However, the impacts are small and not worth worry about. Stop being a nancy and just fit some.

[PetrolDave]

Fitting spacers will apply extra loads on the bearings.

That's always been my big objection to fitting spacers. The wheel bearings have been engineered to take the loads of a wheel bolted direct to the hub, adding spacers increases the turning moment because of the extra lever length and will most likely cause premature bearing failure.

I'm old enough to remember seeing several cars fitted with spacers stopped by the side of the road with a wheel stuck out at a funny angle due to total bearing failure.

I'm not a nancy, I'm an engineer.

[Porky]

I have never had a problem with spacers unless you are taking it to the extreme. TUV approved, hubcentirc ones will be fine. I always make sure that I get some longer bolts made up as well.

[UNI555]

Dave, I remember that too! (also pretty ancient!) although I think people used to use massive spacers, like 2 or 3 inches!!! I also remember people cutting the centre out of steel wheels and welding them back in the other way around! Plus of course the 10" leaf spring hangers jacking up the back of old Fords, with a couple of coils torched out of the front springs to make the nose lower. Absolutely lethal!
Just for the record, I'm not wholeheartedly in favour of spacers either. Yes, I run 10mm spacers all round but this is with wheels which have a 36 offset, so the wheels are only being moved 3mm from their intended position relative to the hub. Having said this I think that using 10mm or less with standard wheels is probably ok and more of a potential wear issue than a safety one.
(I'm an engineer AND a nancy! )

[BlingBling]

Fitting spacers will apply extra loads on the bearings.

That's always been my big objection to fitting spacers. The wheel bearings have been engineered to take the loads of a wheel bolted direct to the hub, adding spacers increases the turning moment because of the extra lever length and will most likely cause premature bearing failure.

I'm old enough to remember seeing several cars fitted with spacers stopped by the side of the road with a wheel stuck out at a funny angle due to total bearing failure.

I'm not a nancy, I'm an engineer.

Dave, I too an am engineer, Mechanical Engineer as opposed to an Electrical Engineer. With that in mind I always stick to what I know, mechanical engineering, and I would be pretty damned surpirsed if Audi selected a bearing that had litlle or not margin for extra axial or radial loads. I have fitted spacers to my previous S3 and current S4 and to date have not had to change a single bearing let alone been left high and dry by the roadside.

[aidanjaye]

Also a mechanical engineer and agree they will have some margin for error, but (and its a big BUT), suppose it all depends on what sort of extreme loads (how uyou drive it) they are subjected too.

[rAudiguy]

I think in these modern times you will be just fine mate. I'm still alive

[stumpyrs4]

If you're that worried about using them, then don't...

I've had 30mm ones on my LandRover Defender without any problems at all. Helps handling no end, by widening the track etc etc...

[lengster1]

Thanks guys,i too am an engineer hence my understanding/concerns about taking the load off the hub and onto the wheel studs,UNI55 you are saying that they are a snug fit in the wheel with no movement? If so thats great as they will allign the wheel correctly and take some of the load and im happy,im looking at 10mm hubcentric rears and a very mild 3 or 5mm plain spacer on the fronts as they pretty much fill the arches allready 5mm would be nice but will check the wheel still locates on the hub as std,if not it will have to be a puny 3mm

[PetrolDave]

Also a mechanical engineer and agree they will have some margin for error

But why eat into the margin just for cosmetic reasons? I think you can be pretty sure the margin won't be as large as used when designing a bridge or a skyscraper.

I'd place safety above cosmetics every time.

[SR71]

Being somewhat provocative, all of you engineers know better than the Audi nerds? (so speaks the ex-Flight Control engineer)



I'm with PetrolDave...although I also place function above cosmetics every time.

I think if you track your car its probably going to cause problems. Thats the main reason I haven't...in conjunction with the wish to retain the ability to fit snow-chains.

Not that its difficult to remove them I suppose....

[UNI555]

The engineers thing is just an attempt to reassure each other (ourselves?) that we aren't total numpties! No, we don't know better than the Audi nerds, I wouldn't have known where to start with designing a cyclonic seperator for a start....oh hang on though...

Seriously, all we are talking about here is preferences and priorities, and although as I've said above my set up involves a very minimal change in offset of 3mm I do think that 10mm is ok. I do understand the concerns though, totally. I also consulted my dealership before doing it and had them do a 4 wheel laser alignment afterwards.

G oing back to knowing better than Audi's engineers, they have to ensure that the wheels will not contact the arch liners in the most extreme situations and the maximum suspension travel. They have to work to a whole set of parameters, constraints and rules, as do all manufacturers, which is why we make little adjustments of our own. The fitting of 275 tyres falls into this category too doesn't it? Audi don't reccomend it, but many on here do it cos they see no reason not to.

Taking the car on the track is in itself going to involve extra wear and tear, on many components, not to mention some risk. I'm not against track days mind, I haven't done one with the RS4 yet but I did about 250 laps of Castle Combe in one year when I had a TVR. I also did hillclimbs and sprints in a variety of machinery years ago, so function does matter to me too. By the way, if you look at what wheels are being run in some club racing saloon classes I'm not sure that having 10mm spacers on for a track day is really a problem! I think though if I do track the RS I'll probably buy a set of 18's with some tyres that didn't cost £300.00 each on them!

Finally, Lengster, yes they are very snug fit, when refitting the wheels all you have to do is rotate the wheel until the holes line up and you can start the threads, no lifting or jostling, so it's all very precise.

[dace]

I have 10mm hubcentric spacers on my car, which brings the offset to oem. I also have 275 tyres and track the car. No problems or issues whatsoever. The spacers fit very tight on the wheel and do not move.

Albeit this is on a B5.