Decoking...

[aidanjaye]

Isnt the B5 lighter than the B7 - also stage 1 on tubo cars is a lot more than a stage 1 on a N/A engine....

Still, I agree with MRC - is Audi know there is a problem, they should fix it either with oil catch tank or better filtration.

[lengster1]

Is it EGR that causes the build up in the b7? Is it possible to disable the system? Im coming from a tuned b5 and want good power from the b7 but dont want to have an expensive decoke every 5k,imo theres no way an inlet system in that condition could NOT loose you power.

[lengster1]

Yes stage 1 on a b5 is easy power with the car being turboed,significant gains on a normally aspirated engine are harder to achieve.I dont think theres alot of weight difference between the cars,I think what he was suggesting was if the b7 had a genuine 414bhp it would easily live with a 420bhp stage1 remapped car but the fact it doesnt suggests the b7 doesnt make 414bhp.

[P_G]

PG, just for the argument's sake, I would be willing to get one of our B7 RS4 engines on an engine dyno and measure it the "right" way if those are the only numbers you believe. Another guy will only believe in 1/4mile numbers, I for one have to believe in another way of comparing power between different cars: street racing. When a stage 1 B5 RS4 puts 5 car lengths on almost any stock B7 RS4 from 60 to 120 mph, well, I'm sorry but I cannot believe that they produce the same BHP, even though we have dynoed dozens of B5 RS4s at 420 BHP with a stage 1, so you cannot really argue with those numbers claims, HOWEVER inaccurated chassis dynos may be.

Regarding oil consumption, you have to take into account that Audi do not want to pay for a new engine if someone uses 1 liter of oil every 700 miles, even though by my books, that sort of consumption would indicate a heavily worn engine, so don't try to be the devil's advocate please... plus, if I remember correctly, your car didn't even dyno 370 BHP stock, so why are you trying so hard to be the devil's advocate here and defend Audi on this issue?

PS: and yes, I know street racing is BAD, I never do it, don't know anyone who ever has and never recommend anyone to do so.

Who said anything about defending Audi? I'm being realistic about this issue as I am with every other 'major' issue these cars supposedly have, always accentuated by forums like these. My car dyno'd 359 bhp at Paramount, so what? The amount of air fed into it at the place wasn't the same as what it would get normal road running, the extraction was not what it should have been and the r/r was seen to be down on numbers compared to other Dyno Dynamics roads using a software program designed for Scoobies and Evo's.

And as for your street racing and stage 1 B5's vs B7's, do you think any company the size of VAG is going to take that seriously? Plus I imagine torque, launch and gear changing plus human factor all have a contribution to that. Yet I can keep up with a Carrera 4S or an M3 coupe on the road, stay with a Noble GT3-R round a track, so does that mean my car actually has 414bhp? I don't even personally believe bench dyno's to be the holy grail of numbers, but since it is the one Audi uses maybe it is the one others will have to use to get them to actually do something about it?

Please refer to my previous posts in this thread and others, I would be as grateful as anyone if Audi do actually announce there is a problem and see fit to do something about it from what Oli, Mac4s or anyone else is doing; but whilst there are so many variables and so little consistent evidence I won't hold my breath and don't advocate anyone else does, hence my posts. There are at least a couple of thousand RS4 owners out there that are happy with their cars compared to the relative handful on here.

[Oli]

I am very happy with mine, I just want more.....or at least what the book says it should be

[aidanjaye]

414HP is what Audi claim but everyone knows that this is the engine HP - after loses of the drive train, the figure on a RR will probably be about 360.

I had a R33 GTR with a lot of stuff done (HKS filters, exhaust, dump valves, uprated fuel pump / regulator and a remap). The figure I was getting quoted was 400 hp. The RS4 is just as quick as the R33 was.

So..reckon its all relative.

BUT, the R33 didn't choke up the engine!

[duud40]

@p_g Mate you surely must consider that most of the people that are happy and content about the power output are not mechanicaly enclined.Most of those that are mechanicaly enclined and also care about theire cars performance don't have time to research the possible causes of problems because as you can see implications are pretty complex. People that are also mechanicaly enclined , care about theyre cars performance and can be bothered to think of possible resolutions .... Well most of them are reading this forum. I am both extremely happy with my car and bothered by what seems to be poor engineering on audis part.

[klauster]

Graeme isn't defending Audi, he is simply stating the facts with regards the way in which companies such as Audi work. While I know something isn't right with my car, I'm still yet to get Audi to take me seriously and actually LOOK at the car. Its booked in again with Audi York on Wednesday. Some warranty work to be done, but I am simply going to say I want more than vag.com diagnostics doing. Thats all dealerships seem to do these days. if they would accept a dyno as at least some evidence that something isn't right that would be start, but at the moment I'm not even getting that!

If anyone does get anywhere with this, i like Oli would welcome it and appreciate evidence that I could present to Audi!

[P_G]

duud40, I understand what you are saying, however if you were a large car manufacturer are you going to listen to a handful of mechanically minded people who buy their cars or are you going to consider the larger majority, mechanically minded or not, who have nothing to say and made no complaints?

Unfortunately it will be the latter and I do not condone that, all I am being is pragmatic about what we as a RS4 owning community are going to get from Audi which traditionally has not been much given the situation with DRC for example.

[SR71]

One wonders whether the C5 RS6 owners got stiffed with their DRC system because even the enthusiasts never bothered to do anything about it...

Au contraire the B7 owners who managed to get some critical mass to their "campaign" and a subsequent result.

klauster,

I have said to Audi that if they open my manifold and its clean, I'll pay. If not, they pay.

But seeing Mac is the guinea-pig at the moment, I'd wait to see what his outcome is...

But even more importantly, I've asked for a statement on why the stuff is there in the first place and what they're going to do about preventing it in the future.

The only way the corporate giant will listen is if more people question the issue.

BTW, as a slight aside, I am also in correspondence with Opie Oils to try and get them to stock the RLI Biosyn oil here in the UK. The oil demonstrably reduces wear in this engine.

[klauster]

One wonders whether the C5 RS6 owners got stiffed with their DRC system because even the enthusiasts never bothered to do anything about it...

Au contraire the B7 owners who managed to get some critical mass to their "campaign" and a subsequent result.

klauster,

I have said to Audi that if they open my manifold and its clean, I'll pay. If not, they pay.

But seeing Mac is the guinea-pig at the moment, I'd wait to see what his outcome is...

But even more importantly, I've asked for a statement on why the stuff is there in the first place and what they're going to do about preventing it in the future.

The only way the corporate giant will listen is if more people question the issue.

BTW, as a slight aside, I am also in correspondence with Opie Oils to try and get them to stock the RLI Biosyn oil here in the UK. The oil demonstrably reduces wear in this engine.

thanks for that, I may well mention that on Wednesday, currently im being nice, but im starting to lose patience with the matter

[P_G]

One wonders whether the C5 RS6 owners got stiffed with their DRC system because even the enthusiasts never bothered to do anything about it...

Au contraire the B7 owners who managed to get some critical mass to their "campaign" and a subsequent result.

klauster,

I have said to Audi that if they open my manifold and its clean, I'll pay. If not, they pay.

But seeing Mac is the guinea-pig at the moment, I'd wait to see what his outcome is...

But even more importantly, I've asked for a statement on why the stuff is there in the first place and what they're going to do about preventing it in the future.

The only way the corporate giant will listen is if more people question the issue.

BTW, as a slight aside, I am also in correspondence with Opie Oils to try and get them to stock the RLI Biosyn oil here in the UK. The oil demonstrably reduces wear in this engine.

What is the latest on the oil SR71?

[mac4RS]

One wonders whether the C5 RS6 owners got stiffed with their DRC system because even the enthusiasts never bothered to do anything about it...

Au contraire the B7 owners who managed to get some critical mass to their "campaign" and a subsequent result.

Spot on...one or two voices is not enough, but collectively in numbers we can make a difference.

''Generally we are a soft nation which accepts 2nd best''. An analogy of this is similar to a bad meal at a restaurant - we don't complain we just don't go back...''

But that's not the answer. Constructive open dialogue to find a solution to the problem has to be the right way, which helps stops this happening to someone else in the future.

We have got to stop accepting ''good enough'' as good enough...

[chrissyr32]

Right ive been thinking about the dreaded coking up issue. SO......

Audi developed and designed this engine,now correct me if i,m wrong but surely it was tested over thousands and thousands of miles both in a car and probably in a lab some where hooked up to all kinds of dianostic equipment?
So surely after extensive testing etc they stripped these engines down and inspect wear,tear deposits etc?? this must be common practice among all car/engine companies? to check on all kinds of perameters etc.

SO

If that was the case and i think it will of been and still is, Audi would have seen the carbon deposits on not just this engine but many others(FSI) and be aware of it?? This tells me they dont see it as a issue that can cause problems or surely they would not have dared develop the engine due to the financial backlash if nothing else.
I dont think this is causing the BHP issues although a lot of the discussion on this forum regarding BHP/deposits etc etc is a little above me as i am not techincally minded!!!

All i know is my car is quicker now than its ever been(17000miles) and long may it continue(que someone saying yeah but how long for??).
All i,m saying is i dont believe for one moment the VAG group has not carried out enough development on FSI engines as to not be aware of the deposit issues or be worried about them.

Nor am i an expert on rolling roads etc but i,d say if you took the engine from the car and tested it without drivetrain i bet it would be producing 400bhp end of(as long as it was maintained properly).

And finally,

If this is a long term problem why oh why are Audi using the same engine in the RS5?? Surely again if they were worried theyd develop a different engine???

Long live the RS4!!! ENJOY THEM WHILE YOU CAN.

[mac4RS]

Audi developed and designed this engine,now correct me if i,m wrong but surely it was tested over thousands and thousands of miles both in a car and probably in a lab some where hooked up to all kinds of dianostic equipment?

Why then has it taken six or seven years for Audi to finally admit they have a problem with DRC on the RS6. Surely this would have been put through thousands of miles testing as well?

It is only through the dogged persistence of a few people that Audi will be replacing with updated & reinforced parts - even that has a sting in the tail because not everbody is covered...

However because of others, this will benefit RS4 owners from updated parts as well.

Let's be honest...there is probably only 10 - 15% of owners that frequent these forums and know of potential problems. The rest, well they are just fobbed off, don't know that they have a problem or know that these issues exist.

I'm sure that there are plenty of people running around with leaky shocks & undeperforming cars with - Audi just love these people...