RS4 BRAKE JUDDER

[Hozz]

I posted another thread about this but I am on my sixth set of discs and it is only this time that they have replaced the hubs as they were running out of true - I had suggested to the dealers on numerous occasions that they ought to look elsewhere and after a peek on these forums and a chat with Camberley Audi, I said to check the hubs and they were out of tolerance...... fingers crossed this is now sorted.

[RS4RS6]

Update!

car has come back from Audi yesterday, with a fresh set of discs! all judder has gone, dealer replaced under goodwill gesture.....not warranty??

The list of reasons which the garage state could be the cause:-

1- oversize tyres.......they are 275 wide rather than 255........ these tyres has been on the car since i purchased it, over 40k with no issues......
2- 3 wheels are buckled...... dont think so as i cannot feel any issues while driving other than the brake judder, and they are balanced when having new tyres!..........
3- DRC issues caused the judder......... all DRC been replaced.................

whats the likley hood of any of the three above would cause the judder?

[RIV]

I've been running 275's for years with no problems, so I reckon you can knock that off the list

[sar]

whats the likley hood of any of the three above would cause the judder?

0%.
i would seriously worry about letting people who believe that work on my car.

[RichT128]

I had exactly the same problem, there's a thread on here somewhere about it. It took nearly a year of going through recommendations from audi's tech centre in Germany to get it sorted, but it is a known issue.

Went through the whole list of recommendations (replacing pads and discs 4 times, getting Audi to do the bedding in, changing the engine mounts and a couple of other things they thought might be the issue - half the car's new now!) but exactly as you describe it would be fine for a few weeks then the judder came back.

Audi uk eventually told the dealership that they've had this problem on a small number of rs4s, and the only solution they had was ceramics. They don't know what the problem is, just that ceramics had fixed every other one they'd dealt with. They did mine under enhanced goodwill, I put some cash in too. It's fixed the problem, and they look great on the car.

I've got to say, listers service centre in Birmingham were fantastic all the way through. Good luck mate

[Gavla]

Have your wheels ever been refurbed?
If so, that could be your problem right there...

This was exactly my issue - clean and rubbed down the wheels and spacers, torqued correctly and 80% of vibration gone - although I think the damage is already done it's still liveable for now....

[brn7y]

Had judder yesterday, car had been parked up for a while with the hand brake on (rookie mistake) they were locked on so had to force release.

Now back brakes are juddering on light braking, could they be warped or may this just be reside?

[KernowPete]

My experience of this is as follows:
Bought the car (07/40k miles) Dec 2010. Judder crept in quite soon after but I failed to get anywhere through Audi either under UA warranty or any kind of goodwill. So I lived with it until May 2012 when it got intolerable. To be fair the discs were quite badly lipped by this point and probably needed replacing anyway. So I replaced them with OEM discs and EBC YS pads then followed the bedding in procedure on the local disused airfield (well as best I could anyway). All was well for a few weeks but then the judder slowly reappeared. Eventually I took it to SW Lotus Centre who put it on their Procut machine and found one of the discs to be running out slightly. So they cleaned everything up, did a skim and all was perfect afterwards. But now, four months later, you've guessed it, the judder is back and seems to be getting worse quickly. I have tried as best I can to not ride the brakes and I never sit with my foot on the brake pedal and its left overnight with the handbrake off. I use the car probably two or three times a week, but I rarely get the chance to get the brakes really hot or perform hard stops. Therefore I would like to think my problems are simple residue build up but I'm not 100% sure. I did have the n/s/f wheel refurbed but that was a long time before it went on the Procut machine and anyway they said it was the other other one that was running out. I guess my best option now is to repeat the bedding in procedure and see what happens?

Another issue I have, which may or may not be related, is a knocking coming from the front of the car over bumps or under braking. I have no DRC issues but may have the loose steering rack bolt issue that also plagues these cars?? I'm pretty sure it's unrelated to the brakes issue.

Any thoughts on either of these welcome cos they're both a PITA.

[johnnydog]

For what it's worth, I have had this problem - repeated brake judder resulting in initially new discs and pads, hubs and bearings all round done as a goodwill gesture by Audi in 2010 (mine is a Sept 07 car which had approx. 20k on the clock). Problem returned and new set of front discs with original pads and new front calipers fitted by Audi with the spirited driving bedding in process done (85 miles and a load of fuel used for the privilege). On each occasion they said the runout was excessive. The problem came back again within a few thousand miles, so Audi fitted ceramics which I was amazed at ( and extremely grateful!!). This was in the first half of 2011, and I have done about 8k since with absolutely no problem whatsoever. The brakes are now superb under all conditions. I must admit that I don't thrash my car and I am not heavy on brakes, but considering that I have several other powerful ( not upto the RS4 though) cars with brakes that cost approx. 150 quid all round to buy, against the 1000 + quid for the fronts only on the RS4 and I've never had an issue with those brakes, which may indicate my driving style is reasonable, makes you wonder....
Incidentally Audi now indirectly encourage drivers to sit on the brake pedal when stopped at traffic lights / junctions with their current automatic / S tonic transmissions (including current S and RS models), which goes against their advice for the problems with the B7 RS4 brakes
I have outlined this issue with my car in greater detail in previous posts on the subject of brake judder, so I would search this site on it - you will get some good info from all on here about it.
I would push for ceramics - if I was in the market for a new car and money was no object, then it would be ceramics without question!

[KernowPete]

Yes, I've researched and posted on this endlessly on here over the last two years but although many many people suffer the same symptons, there doesn't seem to be a common cause. I guess for me I need to keep eliminating things one by one. And what realistically are the chances of Audi giving me a set of ceramics on a 5 1/2 year old car that's now done 57k miles?!

[johnnydog]

From what you say, it seems like the car was between three and four years old when you bought it, and Audi should have records of the initial complaint you raised about the brakes. It would help if you bought it thought the Audi network, of course, but as the defect is more apparent now, and is the same defect you initially reported, would you not have a good case to argue with them about a goodwill gesture or contribution towards the repairs? My experience is that Audi's 3 years warranty is extendable depending on the dealership attitude and if you have had it serviced by them. Brake judder on the RS4 is a well documented fault so be insistant and speak to the Service Manager not the service advisors....the last thing they want is the dreaded 'Audi UK' being mentioned and you contacting them. Mine were sorted eventually through my 'insistance' !

[m14rrv]

hi there mine a similer case but i have put rs4 brakes on a a4 tdi, got front and rears on, replaced front pads and discs, 1k down road brake judder! rang audi, booked in left it there alday got a call saying yes your discs are knacked but we cant replace them under warrenty as there on a car the not ment to be on! was fuming with them, rang audi uk, got no wear, so sat with discs that cost 500 plus that need skimming that should of been replaced under warrwnty

[stu]

Like Johnnydog (and with his advice) I've had my front discs swapped for ceramics after repeated judder. I've been slow to chip in as (a) I wanted to see if the ceramics were the final solution Audi had promised and (b) because it's bloody hard to get them - I don't want to get anyone's hopes up.

It took three new disc failures until the dealership and/or Audi UK caved in and offered a ceramic upgrade for a token payment from me. As far as I know the discs had not been changed prior to my ownership (starting 10/2010 at just under 30k miles), so the first 'problem discs' were put on late summer 2011. Each time, the discs failed within a couple of thousand miles. I was religious with their bedding in. I got quite good at it actually!

Pitfalls I encountered:
The dealer will argue the legitimacy of the parts warranty if they didn't supply the discs themselves. Be prepared with invoices and receipts!
They may claim that you / the fitting garage fitted the discs incorrectly.
Then they may say, despite all that, that the warranty is invalid as the discs weren't bedded in according to the official guidance.
Oh yeah, and they gave me the third degree on light braking / heavy braking / standing on the brake pedal at red lights. Utter rubbish.

Other potential pit falls I can see: no full Audi service history; spacers; non-OEM pads; non-OEM anything really, even seemingly unrelated things like engine mods. They changed an engine mount after failure no.2 in the hope that would prevent a recurrence. Strangely enough it didn't.

My car was off the road for a month in total. It wasn't a very pleasant experience but I think my quiet determination to see it through won in the end.

The ceramics are great. I've have them on my next car, no question.

For what it's worth, I do around 12-15k miles per year, nearly half of which are during the night for part of my job. I think the car is used as quattro GmbH intended

[ASH555]

Is there any negatives with Ceramics?

[HYFR]

Yes, if the discs get damaged you will need to remortgage your house to replace them