How often do you get your RS4 serviced??

[_RS_]

Interesting that you have the long intervals in the UK. The US version is 5k; 15k; 25k; 35k etc OR every 12 months whichever's first. Not that they actually do very much other than oil. I always change oil at 5k between services too. There's so many sensors that I can't see much harm in longer intervals, except oil!

5W40 is the required oil over here btw, manufacturer is up for debate!

[SR71]

jonathon,

You said:

...without soundling like an ass...

and object if someone thinks you are?



Just because I disagree with you does not make me patronising...like Mac4RS said, you've presumably taken offence to a noun you chose to use in the first place....

To me it looks like you just don't like hearing opinions that differ from your own, even when they are backed up with hard data.

I claim no monopoly on understanding the mechanisms whereby RS4 FSI engines are likely to fail, but I do have my own data...along with other enthusiasts data which they have chosen to share...

I once had a Audi Master Tech recommend me a new rear diff on my S2 - quote £5.5K - when all I needed was a new propshaft centre bearing.

Total final bill: £27.50.

Maybe you can understand my cynicism?

My oil is analysed every time it comes out of the car at a cost of £60/test.

The levels of certain metals in the oil is higher than you'd expect which means certain component wear is higher than expected.

You do the math.

Check http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ub ... 308&page=1 for some good discussion on oil.

[chemical-ali]

I am no tech, but have spoken to a number of different tuners and they will all tell you the long life oil is not much kop after a few thousand miles and you are better changing every 6 to 8 k miles or so if you are giving you right foot a bit of attitude now and again. And as SR-71 says, why take the risk for a few quid.

As for Audi guys in the workshop, last thing I had done was a leaking rad. They changed it, still a leak. - wrong rad changed. Took it back in, still leaking after a second rad done, this time the big front one. Third time lucky they fixed it. But they had changed all three!

I didn't complain - I have three new rads. But I wouldn't put too much faith in them without the warranty.

As for engine's not failing because the oil is ok, why is the warranty only 60k or 3 years if the long life system is so great? Don't some other companies offer upto 7 and 100k?

[chemical-ali]

Oh, by the way. SR71 is a cage fighter - so watch out!

[mfire]

It doesn't!

SR-71's oil was found to have a flashpoint of just 100 degrees c when he had it professionally analysed after 5k use.

Out of interest what oil/spec do audi use for fixed servicing?

Err are you sure? My understanding of 'flash point' is that this is the critical temperature that when a flame (spark) is applied to the vapours of a substance it will momentarily flash. if this happens in a confined space it can and does lead to an explosion!! If so better keep my temps down!

[approved]

SR71,what i actually said was ( in its entirity), and it was a question, which you didnt bother to answer, and before you confirmed that you were actually referring to me and not the technician...

without soundling like an ass, how much impact would this decrease in performance have on your car, if you did follow the manufacturers guidelines for servicing your vehicle?

i ask becuase my tech says unless the car is being tracked or driven hard all the time, modern tolerances and oil qualities are that good, that there is no need for additional oil services.

i'm all for opinions, but i'm trying to get to the bottom of why its not advisable to run my car as per the manufacturers guidelines...

i've always followed the instructions i've been given in the user manual of my cars....and never had a problem..i dont understand why the mighty rs4 is different...

as for your patronising tone, the reason i took objection to it, was simply becuase you have a habit of it, and i for one dont particularly like it...

that being my humble opinion...

enjoy your cars guys..for that is all they are...

[sonny]

It doesn't!

SR-71's oil was found to have a flashpoint of just 100 degrees c when he had it professionally analysed after 5k use.

Out of interest what oil/spec do audi use for fixed servicing?

Err are you sure? My understanding of 'flash point' is that this is the critical temperature that when a flame (spark) is applied to the vapours of a substance it will momentarily flash. if this happens in a confined space it can and does lead to an explosion!! If so better keep my temps down!

Hmm so is 131 dagrees High

[P_G]

there you go again..mr patronising i know best...i ask fair questions and i get your snotty nosed replies, again.

Agree with PG; we are entitled to our own opinions. The only remark that SR71 said that may have been condescending, was the tech being an ass - mind you, most of the ones I've met over the years fit this catogory

All I would add regarding techs is that they are only referring to the information that is given to them, therefore are they the real ass? Probably not and by calling them that you invaribaly don't win yourself friends in a dealership when you do have to take your car there.

A bit of politeness has got me a lot of FOC work and parts from my dealer, worth bearing in mind SR71 because they do (and can contrary to belief) read these forums.

[mac4RS]

All I would add regarding techs is that they are only referring to the information that is given to them, therefore are they the real ass? Probably not and by calling them that you invaribaly don't win yourself friends in a dealership when you do have to take your car there.

I quite understand what you are saying PG...maybe ass is the wrong word. It's communications skills that some people lack and sometimes the understanding of how to deal with a problem.

I'm sure most people would like to be helpful and to sort out any issues. But it's just too easy to put the blame elswhere. Third partying is a sign of weakness.

What is definately missing though, is Common Sense. It would appear that died some years ago.

My saying has always been ''there are two ways of skinning a cat''. I'm a very tolerant and polite individual, maybe passionate at times, but treat everybody with respect. I'm no fool either.

My own recent little trial and tribulations came from some of the above mentioned people. Maybe I should have still remained Mr nice & polite like Mr Wilson (hey if you are reading this Mr Wilson, get on down to Audi Camberley & have your car fixed!). However, I would still have car that was not working properly.

All this saga did was cause frustration, valuable time and resource, and more importantly money!

Common sense again - how to turn a problem into an opportunity. This was acheived in the end & quite satisfactory. I'm quite sure that through my persistance and the expertise and common sense of Camberley Audi, will save time & money should similar problems arise elswhere - maybe save a new engine or two...

I have learnt something from this though; if I get a problem again, I will go to Camberley Audi

FOC - yes we all like this, but nothing is really free...we all have to pay for FOC's

If the cap fits...

[mac4RS]

Oh, and on the subject of servicing & from what I have learnt, I do believe that it is invaluable to change your oil regularly - especially if you intend to keep your car for a long time.

[BlingBling]

SR71,what i actually said was ( in its entirity), and it was a question, which you didnt bother to answer, and before you confirmed that you were actually referring to me and not the technician...

without soundling like an ass, how much impact would this decrease in performance have on your car, if you did follow the manufacturers guidelines for servicing your vehicle?

i ask becuase my tech says unless the car is being tracked or driven hard all the time, modern tolerances and oil qualities are that good, that there is no need for additional oil services.

i'm all for opinions, but i'm trying to get to the bottom of why its not advisable to run my car as per the manufacturers guidelines...

i've always followed the instructions i've been given in the user manual of my cars....and never had a problem..i dont understand why the mighty rs4 is different...

as for your patronising tone, the reason i took objection to it, was simply becuase you have a habit of it, and i for one dont particularly like it...

that being my humble opinion...

enjoy your cars guys..for that is all they are...

The reason why I change my oil regularly is becasue I am skeptical about the oil specs. The oil that is specified for my Wifes 3 cylinder Audi 1.4Tdi is the same that is recommended for mine and your cars, which have 5 more cylinders, runs hotter, has more power, revs much much higher (in your case nearly twice as much). This alone is good enough reason to change my oil more often.

The same oil standard is used across the entire VAG ranges and I think the saying "Jack of all trades. Master of none" is appropriate.

[SR71]

jonathon,

Talk about a storm in a teacup....

You seem to have the wrong end of the stick and I keep being on the end of it.



You said (again disengenuously IMHO):

SR71,what i actually said was ( in its entirity), and it was a question, which you didnt bother to answer, and before you confirmed that you were actually referring to me and not the technician...

Lets just remember I did say:

In terms of the performance, you'll only ever know if you crack it open.

Again, not the answer you wanted perhaps, but it is an answer is it not?

As for your technician, I don't really think he is an ass, nor do I ever, walk into dealers kicking off about my car. Basic common sense tells you that isn't going to get you that far....

Its called "irony"....

Did I or did I not, prefix the comment with "IMHO"? I don't see how I could then be called "patronising"?

No doubt we disagree on that too?

My experience of main dealers, is however, aside from Camberley Audi almost universally negative. I always get the over-riding impression they are trying to wiggle out of their obligations and/or pull the wool over my eyes.

Other posters experience demonstrate I am not alone in that sentiment.

However, I do concur with Mac4RS, that, the attitude that some have towards their guarantee is a symptomatic malaise in our society which costs us all money.

The idea that someone else ought to take the responsibility for, what ought to be our own common-sense actions, just means that a warranty gets more and more expensive because they have to cater for the - no other word for it - stupidity of some owners. (Yes I believe the cost of providing a warranty is added to some extent to the RRP.)

The data is all there for you to make your decision. It doesn't bother me if you choose to operate your car according to the manufacturers guidelines. You will probably, most likely, be absolutely fine.

But, the car smokes on start-up, it then dilutes the oil (with all kinds of negative side-effects) which then begins the process of clogging the inlet manifold up which then reduces your performance - and here I disagree with ArthurPE - demonstrably. By that I mean <5%

If you take P_G's car as the best example I know about, its 5% on quoted figures.

I have to say though, that the logic that suggests because you have always followed manufacturer's guidelines, you'll be fine, doesn't appeal to me where a £55K lump of metal is concerned.

You can tell I'm a bit of a cynic.

However, in an attempt to get Audi UK to address some of these "design" issues I have provided them with a significant tranche of data, taken from my own experience and observation of others experience.

Have they had the decency to respond to any of my questions months down the line?

Not yet.

Just the same as Audi USA then.

Just for the record, I think the RS4 is a brilliant car. Like others on the forum, one wonders what to replace it with as it ticks so many boxes. I bought one over a Porsche and I've loved Porsches since I could read.

So I can distinguish between the good and the bad...unlike RussianM3dude...and Audi do do some things extremely well.

PS: My 5w-30 oil reaches 125C on the track...

[PetrolDave]

I have to say though, that the logic that suggests because you have always followed manufacturer's guidelines, you'll be fine, doesn't appeal to me where a £55K lump of metal is concerned.

Agree 100% with that.

The cynic in me says that the manufacturers guidelines are sufficient to allow them to meet the obligations of their 3 year/60,000 mile warranty and still make a profit.

So after 3 years, owners are IMHO to a certain extent "on their own" - which means it makes more sense to provide the engine with the best quality fluids and operating conditions you can from the very beginning, so that you can enjoy the performance without unreasonable fear of big bills caused by avoidable mechanical failures.

IMHO there's a lot of emotion and "mud slinging" appearing in this thread which doesn't help move forward the discussion, which I think should be about the best way we can look after our cars so that we can have the longest enjoyable life from them.

[P_G]

So getting back to servicing and oil change in particular as this appears to be the emotive subject in servicing, if your car is out of warranty would you use a non Audi specified oil if replacing every 5k or so miles?

There are 5W-30 oils out there that are suggested to be better than VW 504.00 and 507.00 spec oils but are not approved, so would you use one? For example and this will be pertinent to those who use and buy from Opie Oils and a discussion I have just had with them, do you go for Silkolene Pro S which is not approved or something like Titan Fuchs / Castrol Edge / Mobil 1.

[PetrolDave]

So getting back to servicing and oil change in particular as this appears to be the emotive subject in servicing, if your car is out of warranty would you use a non Audi specified oil if replacing every 5k or so miles?

There are 5W-30 oils out there that are suggested to be better than VW 504.00 and 507.00 spec oils but are not approved, so would you use one? For example and this will be pertinent to those who use and buy from Opie Oils and a discussion I have just had with them, do you go for Silkolene Pro S which is not approved or something like Titan Fuchs / Castrol Edge / Mobil 1.

I'm out of the 3 year warranty, but have purchased the Audi extended warranty as insurance. So I would stick to the Titan Fuchs/ Castrol Edge/ Mobil 1 - so that I have a negotiating position with Audi if I need it.