Another Angle on Torque Converter 17125 Code

[Q_Cars]

Excellent news on the ATF - I forgot to post before that my ATF was about 1 litre down which was topped up but the fault codes kept coming back.

I had similar fuel trim fault codes after I had the MAFs replaced but the air box was not sat in the seals properly so unmetered air was leaking in and the o2 sensors noted something was wrong and trimmed the fuel to compensate. I had the box removed and replaced with new seals above and below the MAFs and all is well and no fault codes.
I never had the fuel trim fault codes when I had the TC problem.

Had your fuel trim faults appeared while the TC was faulty, recently etc or could they have been there for a while because duff fuel can also cause the problem - the ECU is always trimming but if it exceeds certain values then it records a fault.
If the fuel trim errors appear again you can do a few things to check and depends if the trim is for idle or throttle condition (VAGCOM explains the different blocks relating to each): check the MAF readings and Lambda readings for a run and you can see which scenario make the trim exceed the normal tolerance.

I spoke too soon....17125 fault code back, and I've actually noticed the TC clutch not lock up when it should. And, to add insult to injury, I smelt oil outside the car this afternoon, looked underneath and observed oil splashed around the front passenger-side suspension and surrounds. I think I've just been bitten by the DRC bug.

[bam_bam]

P.S. the real question is, are your boys gonna get their poo together for the Ashes series?

Mooch - Q_Cars is located on Australia's East Island, also known as "eNZud"... they don't play in the Ashes, they are, however, very apt at thrashing the Unglish in the rugby. I'm Aussie and I fancy us doing you in the Ashes, after watching your 2nd game against Bangladesh...
Bet on it?

[Q_Cars]

P.S. the real question is, are your boys gonna get their poo together for the Ashes series?

Mooch - Q_Cars is located on Australia's East Island, also known as "eNZud"... they don't play in the Ashes, they are, however, very apt at thrashing the Unglish in the rugby. I'm Aussie and I fancy us doing you in the Ashes, after watching your 2nd game against Bangladesh...
Bet on it?

Hmm - Austr-ucking-falians & Pomgolians....the ABs will have you both in the Rugby World Cup next year anyway. As for the Ashes, the Engerlish need to harden up compared to their last effort downunder if they want to fancy their chances

Now, where were we....

[bam_bam]

...the ABs will have you both in the Rugby World Cup next year anyway...

...you mean like they've done every RWC since '87, I forget, how many RWC have you won again? I digress, you're boys schooled the Saffa's last weekend, best display I've seen from a rugby team all year (only bettered by the AB's destruction of France late last year). No doubt you've made the Saffa's very, very, very angry - good luck with that at the Cake-Tin.

Good write up on the TC fault, I'm sure your thoughts and experiences are always welcomed. I just wish I could offer more input other than trash talking the two best sports in the world.

[snoopra]

TozoM8 over on RS6.com has removed/rebuilt several transmissions WITHOUT removing engine. (see pic)

[paul_23]

I didn't think it is possible but looks very fiddly to do the tranny with the engine in......wonder how much time it saves?

I heard Tozo also rebuild TCs too; not sure what they are like though...

[Shoppinit]

Heard he modifies the valve bodies too...

[RS6Steve]

We need someone like that here on this side of the pond.... Does he have an international partner?

[bam_bam]

Oh hell yeah, the UK just doesn't do big torque slushies like the US and Oz. I've been meaning to give the ZF certified UK partners a phone call, get their input... alas, zero time, anyone care to take up the slack?

[RS6Steve]

Oh hell yeah, the UK just doesn't do big torque slushies like the US and Oz. I've been meaning to give the ZF certified UK partners a phone call, get their input... alas, zero time, anyone care to take up the slack?

Bam, there is a thread on hear already about that somewhere, they will only do the valve body here!

[bam_bam]

Double damn.

[Q_Cars]

Just to round this thread off...service centre finally agrees that torque converter is faulty and its booked in for replacement. However I also took the opportunity to take stock, and the RS6 has cost me NZ$25,000 in service and repairs (about 12,000 quid at current exchange rates) over the past 15 months. It's not so much the cash (I went into this car with my eyes open), it's the time I haven't been able to use it. The car has been at the service centre every week for the past month for various misdemeanors, including power steering fluid leak, hazard switch and indicator stalk contact failures, tranny (as per thread) and in the past two months has suffered auxiliary coolant pump failure and two other transmission leaks.

Enough is enough. I love driving the beast but it became too hard to own at 155,000 km. I've traded it on an absolutely mint 2007 Merc E63 AMG with 50,000 km on board and an absolutely loaded warranty that I hope I won't need for a while.

I will absolutely miss driving the RS6, but the E63 has already shown that it can make me giggle uncontrollably especially when I turn the ESP off (I told my significant other that ESP stood for Extra Smoke Program....from the tyres that is ).

[paul_23]

A bit off thread but E63 is a viable alternative to rs6 but can you expand on how you find it regarding:
1. Power and low end torque
2. Responsiveness
3. Handling - turn in and also the rear air suspension etc
4. Tranny
5. Build

I am not a fan of Mercs but E63 looks good. My favourite alternative for the RS6 is the Alpina B5s (if I decide to change).
Cheers

[Q_Cars]

A bit off thread but E63 is a viable alternative to rs6 but can you expand on how you find it regarding:
1. Power and low end torque
2. Responsiveness
3. Handling - turn in and also the rear air suspension etc
4. Tranny
5. Build

I am not a fan of Mercs but E63 looks good. My favourite alternative for the RS6 is the Alpina B5s (if I decide to change).
Cheers

I have to say i had to think long and hard re the Merc too. I was interested in the M5 but too many stories of nose-bleedingly high service costs especially for moderate mileage cars. The E63 is a much simpler beast IMHO.

I've still to drive the E63 in a wide range of conditions, but to give my best shot at your questions:

1. It clearly doesn't have the low down urge of the RS6, but the top end is spectacular. It's supposed to make 500 Nm from 2000 rpm and I could believe that. It's also got a heavier throttle feel than the RS6, so I've found I've just got to be a wee bit more assertive on the loud pedal. More a matter of feel as opposed to substance I think. The engine is incredibly smooth and linear.

2. See above I guess. Once at about 3000 rpm I think it is line ball with the RS6.

3. The Airmatic tune on the AMG is waaay better than on the standard Mercs. I run it on Sport 1 for most driving so far, and harden up to Sport 2 for a bit more of a go. Comfy setting is like a big sponge pudding. As for turn-in, a bit like the throttle, I find if you are quite assertive with the turn in you get very good front end bite, but it definitely doesn't quite have the feel/precision of the RS6. If you are slow/soft to turn in it does feel a bit vague. You just need to grab it by the scruff of the neck and drive it I think.

Of course, in the wet it's hard to find anything with the grip and speed of the RS6 - that's a lay down misere to the RS6.

4. Nice tranny, much much much better than RS6, but it does still have a wee lag in shifts even with the paddles. Not nearly as noticeable as with RS6 though.

5. Build - v happy with what I've seen so far. No rattles squeaks etc, and I find the cabin ambience quite good if not quite as crisp as Audi's best.

If you've seen the Top Gear E63 v M5 wagon (oops, estate) comparo, I thought JC's description of the E63 was pretty much spot on (haven't driven the M5 so can't compare that one). And I note that the E63 ran away from the M5 in a straight line!

[bam_bam]

Bam, there is a thread on hear already about that somewhere, they will only do the valve body here!

I thought it was familiar, I wrote that comment about ZF UK will not upgrade components etc. What I meant was, the ZF UK partners:

ZF UK do not perform servicing or sell parts (other than full remanufactured gearboxes) to the public in the UK, however, the outlets of ZF Germany will perform these services. ZF UK have servicing partners that have access to all of the ZF parts and knowledge base. I was told these are the better ZF partners:
JP automatics – 0845 130 4754 (Bristol)
Sussex Autos – 0132 384 886

I hope this helps.

Sussex Autos seem to rebuild TCs and are ZF UK partners but they make no mention of VB rebuilds/upratings. I'll be giving them a call soon, when I get the time... or someone else can take up the slack innit.
http://www.sussexautos.co.uk/torque-converters.php