Hello all,
Right then, my car is currently down at Automatic Transmissions in Preston where the gearbox had been overhauled last year.
Since then it started to flare in between 1st and 2nd gear change, almost as if it disengaged 1st gear and was slow to engage 2nd. If i held the throttle at WOT in between gear changes it would eventually engage 2nd gear with a heavy thud then continue to rev as normal. This situation was getting worse and worse to the point where i could take off fairly easy in 1st then select 2nd, if i then pressed the throttle down hard in between 1st and 2nd gear change i could get it to rev to the red line quite easily before 2nd would eventually engage.
First of all a new valve body was fitted and the car test driven with no difference to my problem.
I was sure my 2nd gear clutch pack was worn or had a nipped "O" ring somewhere reducing pressure in the system, however following strip down there was nothing untoward found, all clutch packs were found to be in good condition with no signs of slippage or excessive wear.
Since the box was stripped down he fitted a new second gear clutch pack, new seals throughout, new piston for 2nd gear and a new hydraulic accumulator damper, the car is going back together now with a test drive on Tuesday hopefully.
The chap who built the box, who has many years specialising in this profession said he was not surprised to find no mechanical wear or damage and believes it's a software related issue where the software has started to drift. Not sure what exactly that means??
I explained to him that this issue started when i tried sports mode one day then went down hill from there starting to flare in tiptronic then eventually in drive over a period of a few weeks.
I'm just not convinced on the software theory but since there was nothing found when the box was stripped down I'm out of ideas.
Is there any advice you guys can give me?
Thanks in advance.
Gordon
Gearbox strip down conclusion
Gearbox strip down conclusion
Last edited by gmac78 on Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
That damn drifting software. I have the same problem with Excel. I start off the month with lots of money and by the end it's all drifted down to zero. Damn Bill Gates.gmac78 wrote:believes it's a software related issue and he thinks the software has started to drift. Not sure what exactly what that means??
Daytona RS6 C5 Avant. Viper'd, Billies, Waggers, MTM box brain, C6 stoppers, xcarlink, R8 coolant cap (woohoo)
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
Are they changing the torque converter while the gearbox is out?
Avus Avant, RNS-E mk2 with sds and Bluetooth, Milltek, Hotchkis, Bilstein, Forge, ITG, A.C.E, Wagner, FBMFSW, MTM.
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
This sounds like the infamous cracked ATF pipe issue.
I call bullsh1t on the software theory. Doesn't make any sense at all. The TCU adjustment values can be reset by Audi (or possibly by the rumoured holding pedal down method), but you'd think a gearbox specialist would know this and be able to reset it when "rebuilding" a box.
Even so, it sounds like the ATF pressure isn't making high enough / making it to the box. Or maybe they rebuilt it with standard 5HP24 parts instead of the RS6 specific clutches.
I hate the unknowns when you get someone to "rebuild". The only way to be sure, IMO, is to go with a box that's remanufactured which is a legal definition, as opposed to refurbished, repaired or reconditioned which are not.
I call bullsh1t on the software theory. Doesn't make any sense at all. The TCU adjustment values can be reset by Audi (or possibly by the rumoured holding pedal down method), but you'd think a gearbox specialist would know this and be able to reset it when "rebuilding" a box.
Even so, it sounds like the ATF pressure isn't making high enough / making it to the box. Or maybe they rebuilt it with standard 5HP24 parts instead of the RS6 specific clutches.
I hate the unknowns when you get someone to "rebuild". The only way to be sure, IMO, is to go with a box that's remanufactured which is a legal definition, as opposed to refurbished, repaired or reconditioned which are not.
Daytona RS6 C5 Avant. Viper'd, Billies, Waggers, MTM box brain, C6 stoppers, xcarlink, R8 coolant cap (woohoo)
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
The torque converter was changed in march of last year so only around 7k miles on it, it's not getting replaced this time round. Doubt he would have gone for that anyway if I had suggested it. As for the software issue, i agree that it sounds like a load of nonsense!! I tried resetting the adaption values using VCDS which made no difference.
As for the clutches, he said there was no wear on them and have kept them to show me the condition they were in when removed. So going by that i guess we can eliminate them from the scenario.
Whats the crack with this ATF pipe then? Any pics?
Is this something obvious that should have been picked up on when stripping the box down?
Thanks guys.
As for the clutches, he said there was no wear on them and have kept them to show me the condition they were in when removed. So going by that i guess we can eliminate them from the scenario.
Whats the crack with this ATF pipe then? Any pics?
Is this something obvious that should have been picked up on when stripping the box down?
Thanks guys.
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
You can't do it with the Vagcom.
Don't have any details on the ATF pipe thing, but it's a common issue that causes loss of pressure. It should be accessible just by removing the valve body.
Don't have any details on the ATF pipe thing, but it's a common issue that causes loss of pressure. It should be accessible just by removing the valve body.
Daytona RS6 C5 Avant. Viper'd, Billies, Waggers, MTM box brain, C6 stoppers, xcarlink, R8 coolant cap (woohoo)
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
Ah right, there is something within VCDS for resetting gearbox adaption values, my mistake, thought it was the same thing.
Im intrigued about this ATF pipe now, do you not think that if this pipe was at fault the flaring issue would be present in all gears, not just 1st to 2nd? Yet again maybe, don't know enough about it….
Im intrigued about this ATF pipe now, do you not think that if this pipe was at fault the flaring issue would be present in all gears, not just 1st to 2nd? Yet again maybe, don't know enough about it….
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
No, my understanding is that it only causes a problem on 1st to 2nd gear changes.
Like I said, nothing you can do wih VCDS. I'm not sure what Audi do to reset the TCU. Maybe reflash it.
In fact, forget the reset thing, it's a red herring. You almost certainly have a mechanical problem. There are testing points on the box that can be used for measuring ATF pressure. Also the Vagcom can give you a lot of information about what solenoids and things are doing. It doesn't sound like anyone has any intention of doing any proper diagnostics on your box though.
If you really want to be sure, swap your TCU with another one.
Like I said, nothing you can do wih VCDS. I'm not sure what Audi do to reset the TCU. Maybe reflash it.
In fact, forget the reset thing, it's a red herring. You almost certainly have a mechanical problem. There are testing points on the box that can be used for measuring ATF pressure. Also the Vagcom can give you a lot of information about what solenoids and things are doing. It doesn't sound like anyone has any intention of doing any proper diagnostics on your box though.
If you really want to be sure, swap your TCU with another one.
Daytona RS6 C5 Avant. Viper'd, Billies, Waggers, MTM box brain, C6 stoppers, xcarlink, R8 coolant cap (woohoo)
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
///M3 E46 | XC90 (V8, natch) | Passat GTE | RR Classic V8 flapper
"The major difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong it usually turns out to be impossible to get at and repair."
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
No it's not bill gates .........it's the called the c5 drift fund as I have the same problem!Shoppinit wrote:That damn drifting software. I have the same problem with Excel. I start off the month with lots of money and by the end it's all drifted down to zero. Damn Bill Gates.gmac78 wrote:believes it's a software related issue and he thinks the software has started to drift. Not sure what exactly what that means??
950 nm torque!
Ohh running bridgestones because they are the best
Ohh running bridgestones because they are the best
Re: Gearbox strip down conclusion
Shoppinit wrote:No, my understanding is that it only causes a problem on 1st to 2nd gear changes.
Like I said, nothing you can do wih VCDS. I'm not sure what Audi do to reset the TCU. Maybe reflash it.
In fact, forget the reset thing, it's a red herring. You almost certainly have a mechanical problem. There are testing points on the box that can be used for measuring ATF pressure. Also the vagcom can give you a lot of information about what solenoids and things are doing. It doesn't sound like anyone has any intention of doing any proper diagnostics on your box though.
If you really want to be sure, swap your TCU with another one.
You would think that they would do all the simple checks first of all before removing the box???? i've just sent the guy a message asking if he carried out gear change pressure checks prior to removing the box, see what he comes back with i guess. I'll certainly be asking to get it done if it's the same once it's back up and running!
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