Sat Nav Plus - DIY install

[Dippy]

I have been PM'd by a few people asking for more details about installing Audi Sat Nav Plus, so I decided to post rather than make too many individual replies.

Notes:
i) I am writing with respect to installing into an A4/S4/RS4. Installing into an A6/S6/RS6 or A8/S8 has slightly fewer problems. Installing into an A3/S3 is slightly different.
ii) When I refer to E-bay, I mean German E-bay (http://pages.ebay.de/)
iii) When buying from E-bay, don't forget about postage and money transfer costs. I managed to get a lot of kit from a single supplier, so this ended up only about 10% extra on the costs I menton.

The cost and effort depends on 2 factors:
What you are upgrading from
How much of the available kit you want to install

1) What have you got now?
The Sat Nav Plus head unit is double-DIN and is only a Radio/Nav unit. It's CD slot is only for a navigation CD, so if you want audi CDs then you need a changer. So the implications of installing Sat Nav Plus vary according to what you start from:

a) Age of the car
Cars built in 2000 on had updated CAN bus systems. This means that in 1999 and earlier cars, to have the Sat Nav Plus display on the DIS, you must install an older unit which has no TMC capability and limited map update support. Newer models, such as the B6 A4 have further modifications which mean that only the more modern Sat Nav units will work.

b) Concert Radio
Because this is single-DIN, an install would require replacing the centre console cage with a double-DIN unit. These are often available on E-bay and installing it is actually not difficult (it's work yes, but not hard). However unfortunately it means that the aircon unit has to be moved down and now it's fascia is the wrong shape. This means either modifying the (integral) fascia, or buying the correct one. They are very expensive new, but used ones do appear on E-bay from time to time.

c) Symphony Radio
Ideal, because the Sat Nav Plus head just fits in the same slot.

d) CD Changer
If you already have one then great, because (assuming it's OEM) the Sat Nav Plus head will control it. If you don't have one then you'll either have to put up with radio only, or buy and install one. Installation is easy except for running the cable.

e) Sat Nav III
This is the basic system with a CD unit in the boot and a small controller next to the drivers seat. If you have this then the main advantage is that you don't have to install a GPS antenna and run a cable. It also means that wiring up a TV tuner is slightly easier. Note that the small controller does not work with Sat Nav Plus (although I am investigating this).

f) Multifuntion Steering wheel
These controls should work with Sat Nav Plus. Mine did straight away, however I have read that others had problems.


2) What kit do you need/want to install?
The minimal system is a Sat Nav Plus head and GPS antenna.
Optional kit is a CD changer, CAN gateway, TMC tuner, TV tuner, AV inputs/outputs, Telematics, Voice command and Logbook.

a) Head unit
Units for the B5 are hard to come by. One was sold for £500 on UK e-bay recently. That's the cheapest I have seen. So alternatively you can buy one from an A6 or A8 and change the fascia. I waited patiently on E-bay and got an A6 unit for about 200 euros. Then I bought an A4 fascia for about 100 euros. Don't forget about postage and money transfer costs. I
managed to get a lot of kit from a single supplier, so this ended up only about 10% extra.

You also need a harness adapter. These are readily available on E-bay for around 25 euros.

Installing the head unit is almost 'plug and play', depending on your final configuration.

Optionally you may want a GALA switch (so that you can use the TV/video screen on the move), and also to wire in a reverse signal (I did on mine, but I doubt it is essential).

b) GPS antenna
This is absolutely necessary. You can either do an OEM install (antennas on E-bay for around 70 euros, and cables for around 20 euros) which means fitting the antenna to the back of the car and running a cable to the front, or use an aftermarket antenna and choose where to put it.

c) CD changer
I already had one so didn't have to install one. I'm not sure on the cost, but I guess Vag parts is a better option than a used one from E-bay. The cables are available on E-bay for around 30 euros. Installing may mean a metal cage in the rear if you have no equipment already, and running a cable to the front. Alternatively you could do a custom install in the glovebox.

d) CAN gateway
On 1999 and earlier cars, the radio and Sat Nav units control the DIS display with a 'pre-CAN' system. So the older 'C' Sat Nav Plus heads will work directly with the DIS, but the newer 'D' heads will not.
On 2000 on cars, the DIS uses CAN, but not the same CAN that Sat Nav Plus uses! So to get the DIS working you need to buy and install a CAN gateway. The price varies a lot and I paid about 70 euros for mine. You also need a wiring kit for about 60 euros on E-bay. Wiring it means adding some wires to the SatNav Plus harness adapter. If like my 2001 car, Audi cheated with the wiring, you also need to run 2 wires to a connector under the dash.

Mounting can be done properly with the proper hardware in the dash area, or else the small unit can be put in several other places (I had to do the latter because Audi had not built my car to accept the correct mounting hardware).

e) TMC tuner
This is a device which receives coded traffic information (on Classic FM in the UK) and sends it to the Sat Nav Plus, allowing it to dynamically re-route you around motorway traffic jams. But it only works if you have a coded navigation CD (which costs an extra £60-70!).
If you want one of these be careful about what you get.
MOST Audi TMC units are actually combined TMC tuner/CAN gateways.
SOME Audi TMC units are actually ONLY CAN gateways
ALL Blaupunkt TMC units are ONLY TMC units.
The one I bought (mentioned above) is a combined TMC/CAN gateway.
Wiring is easy - you use two cables to simple 'break into' the radio cable.

f) TV tuner
This device sits in the rear (in the same cage as the CD changer) and can receive TV signals and display them on the Sat Nav Plus head screen. It is probably the most expensive and PITA part of an install.
The units are not expensive, available on E-bay for about 100-150 euros (although I got mine for about 50). There are two types and I strongly recommend the newer B unit. You also need a plastic case to install it in the cage. I already had one (from my Sat Nav III unit). If the TV tuner doesn't have one then you'd probably have to buy a new one (but they shouldn't be expensive for what they are).
Unfortunately there's more:
You need a harness/cable (around 60 euros from E-bay) which must be run to the front of the car and connected to the Sat Nav harness adapter. You also need to connect a few wires into the car's existing wiring. If you had a Sat Nav III installed, this is easy. If not you may need to run a few additional wires.

You need to replace your existing antenna amplifiers (3 on the Avant and 4 on the saloon). This is because with just a radio installed, the amplifiers will by tuned to FM frequencies. To make the TV work you need TV/FM ones which extend to UHF. These very rarely appear on E-bay so you may have to buy new (£50 each from Vag parts).

You also need a diversity switcher. Again these very rarely appear on E-bay so you may have to buy new (£100 from Vag parts).

Finally you need at least 4 antenna cables to connect the TV tuner.
Installation depends on what was in the car to start with. Most of it is straightforward, but the antenna amplifiers can be difficult to access (except for the Avant where only one of them is difficult).

g) AV inputs/outputs
If you have the TV tuner, then you can add two auxilliary AV inputs with a 1230 adaptor from Dietz (about 50 euros on E-bay). You can also add two AV outputs (e.g. an LCD monitor) with a 1206 unit (I could only get this new for £90). Of course you then need to run AV cables to wherever you want the connections (I have 1 AV input in the glovebox, and 1 AV input and the 2 AV outputs in the rear centre console where the VAG-COM connector is).
Alternatively if you don't have a TV tuner, you can buy devices which allow you to connect AV i/o directly to the Sat Nav Plus head.

h) Telematics
For basic telephone connection, the Sat Nav Plus has the same telephone input and mute connections as other radios. It also has the facility to interface to Audi's more advance telematics systems. I think most of this is only really of value in Germany however.

i) Voice command
Audi offer a voice control unit which will operate the Sat Nav Plus and a telephone. Possibly this was only available on the A8, but in theory it could work in any car. I have never seen one appear on E-bay so the chances of my installing it are very low...

Update 27/10/04: 2 such units came up on E-bay recently but I lost them. Stupid really because I had got agreement from the seller to ship to UK, and then got outbid right at the end when I usually just set my proxy bid high enough. At least now I know that they do come up sometimes and so I will keep looking.

j) Logbook
Audi offered this only in Germany. All I know about it is that it is a data transfer system which allows you to exchange navigation information between the Sat Nav Plus and a PC. This may be direct, via as memory card, or both. I believe there is a unit which goes in the glovebox and has a card reader. Maybe it also allows MP3 capability but I'm not sure. Again
since I have never seen anything for this appear on E-bay, the chances of my installing it are very low...

Finally
A few extra notes on installation.
1) On reflection, although my installation involved quite a lot of work, none of it was particularly difficult. As you might expect, the only difficulties were where I didn't know how to dismantle parts of the trim (such as the aircon unit). Now that I know, I am sure I could do my complete install again (Sat Nav Plus, TV with AV i/o and TMC) within a day. That assumes that the harness was pre-prepared, which is only half a day's work.
2) You may need to do some 'custom wiring' including soldering. If you really have not done this before then please do not attempt it.
3) You might get away with not having to do any programming, but I doubt it. Access to VAG-COM is invaluable.
4) I did not come to this cold. First I read Dan Gold's excellent website http://www.tvwiz.net/navigation which covers a lot of what I have written above. If you are still interested after reading this post, now check out his site.

UPDATE: I never got around to stating this before. Dan Gold was forced to take his site down because he has also been providing information on how to copy SatNav CDs. Fortunately the SatNav part of his site was duplicated here: http://www.nav-plus.com/instructions/

Cheers,
Dave

[SimonS4MTM]

Great write up, if only i had the time and the money

[Mik]

Superb, just about to fit one to my S4. This will help a lot

Mik

[RS4_STEVO]

Dave

Thanks for this mate, it's helped me out a lot!!!

I have the Symphony Radio, and CD Changer anyway, so this should be a little easier!

Do u want to fit mine?

[Dippy]

Whereabouts are you?

[RS4_STEVO]

I'm up in Edinburgh, but travel South frequently so could come down to yours! If I was to try and source the kit, how much would you take for fitting it?

Cheers

[wombat]

Hi Dave,

great write-up. I am part way through retro fitting a Navi Plus to an S4 B6 and due to Dan's guidance (tvwiz.net) it's all been straight forward so far. Yesterday the TV Tuner bits arrived (German eBay) complete with replacement antenna amplifiers and cables. The bad news is that TVWiz does not explain whether you need to fit new TV antennae or not. For the B6 chassis Dan simply says, "contact me for more information" but he has yet to reply to the last two notes I sent.

- Did you use the existing FM antennae in your B5 and just change out the amps?

- What sort of plug do your existing antennae terminate in? Is it a small flat plastic connector with 3/4 pins?

- Did you manage to buy a diversity switcher, I've been watching eBay and have never seen such a device for sale?

Sorry for all the questions but I want to clear my confusion up before I strip the car down for a day's tinkering.

Thanks

Darren
--

[Dippy]

I'm up in Edinburgh, but travel South frequently so could come down to yours! If I was to try and source the kit, how much would you take for fitting it?

Cheers

Steve,
I'm sure we could come to an agreement. How much of the kit do you want to install? Procurement is going to take enough time and effort for you anyway before you are ready for installation.

Cheers,
Dave

[Dippy]

Hi Dave,

great write-up. I am part way through retro fitting a Navi Plus to an S4 B6 and due to Dan's guidance (tvwiz.net) it's all been straight forward so far. Yesterday the TV Tuner bits arrived (German eBay) complete with replacement antenna amplifiers and cables. The bad news is that TVWiz does not explain whether you need to fit new TV antennae or not. For the B6 chassis Dan simply says, "contact me for more information" but he has yet to reply to the last two notes I sent.

Well you don't need new antennae for the B5 so I can't see why you would need any for the B6. They are just wires after all (that's all an antenna is anyway - remember that a portable TV has just a loop antenna - it's all about signal quality).
Yes, Dan's responsiveness varies. He's a great guy and helps whenever he can, but I guess he's got a life outside SatNav!

- Did you use the existing FM antennae in your B5 and just change out the amps?

Yes. To my surprise Audi produce 1001 different amps. Don't they realise how much money they could save by standardisation of components? Your car will be fitted with FM amps. You need FM/TV amps. You will need the right part numbers for your car. You'll need to get the right data from ETKA. I looked on the Russian site (http://www.elcats.ru/audivw/) but couldn't find the info for a B6.

- What sort of plug do your existing antennae terminate in? Is it a small flat plastic connector with 3/4 pins?

Yes, as per the photos on Dan's site.

- Did you manage to buy a diversity switcher, I've been watching eBay and have never seen such a device for sale?

BTDT. I saw one come up including a harness. But the final price was about twice the cost of a new switcher from Vag Parts. I decided the harness was not worth that much. I suggest you just go to Vag Parts. Probably true for the amps too.

Sorry for all the questions but I want to clear my confusion up before I strip the car down for a day's tinkering.

No problem. My job's quite boring at the moment and I have time to spend on this.

[RS4_STEVO]

Dippy, you have PM!

[wombat]

Hi Dave,

thanks for the quick response.

Yes, Dan's responsiveness varies. He's a great guy and helps whenever he can, but I guess he's got a life outside SatNav!

This is the bit I'm concerned about from tvwiz.net:

Note that the 2002 and higher A4 cars have a unique antenna system. Contact me for more information.

I have written to Dan to ask for "more information" but he has not responded (I understand that he is busy). Perhaps I will ask if anyone on the Yahoo mailing list knows more...

Yes. To my surprise Audi produce 1001 different amps.

The good news is that my tuner from German eBay came with the right amps for FM/TV... Hmmm, double checked on TvWiz and can't find a piccie of the end of the antenna cable that plugs into the amp (flat plug). Can you point me in the right direction (feel like a right plonker having to ask...)?

I'm not sure what function the diversity switcher performs and I wonder if it has been misnamed. Does the diversity switcher connect to both the TV tuner and the Radio tuner in the Navi Plus as well as the outputs from the TV/Radio Amps?

Thanks

Darren
--

[Dippy]

Darren,

Don't forget that AFAIK Dan has just done the install on his B5 S4, and what he knows about the other cars is though his associations on the Yahoo mailing list and the knowledge he has gained over the years. So I think you do need advice from another B6 owner.

Yes the diversity switcher handles both Radio and TV signals. It takes the inputs from the antenna amps and the passes the signals to the Sat Nav head. It selects the strongest signal by muting the others. Maybe 'diversity switcher' is an unusual name but it is accurate.

I don't know about the antenna connectors, since I just swapped out the amps with the ones already in my car. Don't you already have antennas with the plugs connected.

Whilst talking about connectors, there are special SMB ones on the TV tuner and switcher. Although I've used basic SMB connectors, you can get the correct ones. See this thread: http://www.vwnavi.com/vwnavi/forums/sho ... .php?t=863

[Nige_RS4]

Dave, excellent write-up - it has almost persuaded me to get on and do this upgrade. How do you establish if your car has a CAN-BUS or not, as I have a facelift 99.5 S4 with DIS sat nav and concert radio, and analogue clock - a lot of the info on tvwiz.net refers to 2001+ models i.e. US cars, so it can be slightly misleading for us in the UK.

Cheers, Nige.

[Dippy]

Nige,

There are actually at least separate 3 CAN busses in my car. However the one that counts is the "info" or "display" CAN. Yours does not have this (indicated by your analogue clock). That means that currently your DIS is controlled by an older (I think VAG proprietary) serial comms system.

This is described on Dan's site (www.tvwiz.net) when he explains the difference between the older Navi C and the newer Navi D.

You could install a Navi C into your car and it would work with the DIS without modification. However Navi C does not have some of the features of Navi D (like TMC). I suggest you read about this. TMC is not available in the US but it IS here and I think it is an excellent feature.

So instead you could install a Navi D and either not have the DIS working (which I think would be a bit crap because during navigation the DIS complements the Sat Nav + display well and is easier to read when driving), or you could replace your Instrument cluster with a new one. Don't be too worried about the latter because as long as you can get one from e-bay (as you imagine VAG prices are rather high), actually replacing the instrument cluster is not very difficult as long as you're happy doing a bit of wiring and you have access to VAG-COM to adapt the new cluster.

[peterb]

TMC is not available in the US but it IS here and I think it is an excellent feature.

I agree, but it would be even better if whoever arranges the licence (Blaupunkt/Tele Atlas/?) gave us access to the off-motorway data.