Standard RS4 is unreliable and not such a great car... TRUE?

[Franzino]

The car I’m going to buy needs to be fast, exiting and reliable… There are 3 cars that I like, fill in my needs and that are in my budget. The cars are 2001 M3, 2001 M5 and 2001 RS4.

I want to buy a good reliable car and don’t want to spend a lot more cash on extra’s (other suspension, other brakes, other gearbox, etc) to make it a great car. I want to buy a reliable car that is great in standard form…. It will be a used car and maybe a private buy, so no warranty….! Almost every used RS4 I have found was a standard RS4 without modifications.

I really, really, really want to like the RS4! But I'm afraid. I like the looks and the purpose. And I like the Quattro set-up. But, after reading this forum it looks like a standard RS4 is not such a great car and has a lot of problems. You need to make some expensive modifications to get a really good driving RS4 and hope your gearbox, clutch, wheels and turbo’s don’t break… These things are big costs.

This is my conclusion after reading about the RS4.
Correct me if I’m wrong….
Please tell me I’ wrong!!!!

- Clutch problems: weak clutch, fast replacement after low KM use.
- Gearbox problems: a lot of people need to replace them (high costs).
- Turbo’s: people are not sure how long they live (high costs)
- Shift problems: you need to fit short shift to get a nice working gearbox.
- RS4 wheels problem: they get damaged easily.
- Brake problems: owners say standard brakes are underpowered.
(But this is something I never read in a test in a magazine).

So what about this conclusion and how reliable and how good is a “STANDARD” RS4? My biggest concern is the gearbox and turbo’s will propably break and need replacement. I don't want to make those massive extra costs.

Okay an E46 M3 has also some problems. Fade sensitive brakes and some people in had engine failure but that’s seems to resolved with the older models. The 2000 E39 M5 had some oil consumption problems, but the revised 2001 seem to be a problem free car and a really good performer in standard form…

Thanks for your opinions...

[PhilT]

The wheels are probably your only issue if you buy a stock/standard 2001 RS4. Check them before you buy. If you do not intend going on the track regularly with the car, then you don't need to think about mods.

[Doc]

Franzino me old mucker, all the cars you are thinking about buying approx 4 years old will cost you large bills potentially IF something goes wrong! These are all in the premium sector of the market when they were new and therefore maintenance costs now they are 4 years old are an expected part of the ownership equation! Remember that many owners who have had these cars under warranty may not accurately assess the costs of ownership beyond routine servicing, simply because warranty protection can (and will) give you a false sense of overall ownership costs. Cars without warranty can give you greater cost exposure.

If you buy a 4 year old or more car then you will undoubtedly spend money to ensure all is as you wish if you are a fastidious owner (even keeping the car standard). So after all that what does this mean.....

For BMW info on the M's go visit bm3w.co.uk to find out all you need to know on the M5 & M3. here are some examples....
- M5 (e39) common to find clutch issues, needing replacement repeatedly. Many will tell you not to buy an M5 without warranty coverage (sounds familiar )
- M3 (e46) commonly discs/pads changed within first 12000 miles manifest as brake juddering; door handles problematic/faulty; engine issues

ALL of the above normally covered on warranty to illustrate my point. The M3 being the least expensive to maintain in my experience

On specialist forums you will always have issues highlighted which can give the impression that the cars have only problems and therefore not worth the fuss, not true hence we all need to keep this in context.

I can vouch for the BM's having owned some of those you mentioned and thus far with the RS, I would also buy the car again.

Go enjoy, as each of your car choices is excellent

Story, end of

[derdle]

I would agree with the above. I bought my RS4 privately and was able to have an Audi warranty placed on the car via the dealer. All they need to do is a "pre warranty inspection" and if the car passes you can buy a warranty. If you decide not to buy the warranty then you'll need topay teh dealer for the inspection.

The stock car is perfectly adequate for normal road use - the mods are for people who want track use or for mopre extreme road driving.

I can only re-iterate that any 4 year old high performance car can experience expensive problems. I bought mine at 44,000 miles and after a year of every day use (it's my only car) a turbo bearing failed - only a bearing mind you, but the warranty covered the full replacement cost. From conversations I have had, I gather that Audi dealers are better than BMW dealers with customer care etc. IMHO my dealer is v good, not "brilliant" but very good.

[lengster1]

I agree with all of the above responces,but would like to add a few points,turbos have a question mark over em from day one some will last 150k others fail early depends on the care you take warming up and cooling down and of course good oil,wheels easily sorted if you want the hard ones fitted,ive been ao hear a while know and not heard of anyone blowing a gearbox up,it does happen but not as often as you seem to think,buying an 01 car helps they have the revised box,i looked deeply into getting an m3 and they have some serious engine/smg issues,buying one privatley with no warrenty is a very brave move you will get a good deal but find it very very hard to sell on privatley with no warrenty bm3w will confirm this,many m5s bought and sold privatley need warrentys to ease the sale,best of luck making your mind up,get a good rs4 and you wont regret it especially with the tuning potential,good luck

[Golich]

I too would agree with Doc. Unfortunately I had my turbos replaced at 34K but under warranty. You can buy a 3rd party warranty from Warranty direct for £730. This covers the turbos and gearbox etc etc. I would recomend this as I reckon after your first year of ownership your going to find any major failures.

As for the performance of the standard car. What can I say it has 325ftlbs of torque and with the speed limiter removed does 170mph, yes on a stock ECU! (It cost nothing to remove the limiter get a Revo trial - that removed the limiter from mine!) The standard brakes, power and handling is fine for the road.

Go look and drive your alternatives only then will you know what you really want.
The RS4 is the ultimate all round package for me. I've got my bike racks on the roof and can lug any amount of stuff and people in the back. 4x4 for the wet and snow and exclusivity.

[Franzino]

Franzino me old mucker, all the cars you are thinking about buying approx 4 years old will cost you large bills potentially IF something goes wrong!

That’s true, if something really terrible goes wrong. It will cost money. But this is the case for most used cars out of warranty. That’s why I’m looking if the RS4 has lot of problems. I want to minimise the risk for big breakdowns.

ALL of the above normally covered on warranty to illustrate my point. TheM3 being the least expensive to maintain in my experience

How come?

I can vouch for the BM's having owned some of those you mentioned and thus far with the RS, I would also buy the car again.

Which BM’s have you owned and why exactly would you buy the RS4 again?

[Franzino]

I would agree with the above. I bought my RS4 privately and was able to have an Audi warranty placed on the car via the dealer. All they need to do is a "pre warranty inspection" and if the car passes you can buy a warranty. If you decide not to buy the warranty then you'll need to pay the dealer for the inspection.

I’m not sure this is possible in Belgium to have this kind of warranty. I need to check it…

The stock car is perfectly adequate for normal road use - the mods are for people who want track use or for more extreme road driving.

I will take the car to the track a couple of times a year. And yes you can qualify me under someone who has a more extreme way of road driving.

[RS4ever]

This thread is beginning to irritate me.

What exactly do you want us to say. The vote is 90%. Do you want 100%. If so, buy a NEW CAR.

[Doc]

I'll try and be brief/concise

Franzino me old mucker, all the cars you are thinking about buying approx 4 years old will cost you large bills potentially IF something goes wrong!

That’s true, if something really terrible goes wrong. It will cost money. But this is the case for most used cars out of warranty. That’s why I’m looking if the RS4 has lot of problems. I want to minimise the risk for big breakdowns.

Easy, then buy a new car because the usage history of the car prior to your ownership will determine whether anything will go wrong soon. You can't do anything about that. AND obviously as the car has undergone more wear n tear your service costs increase considerably...its a secondhand car after all

ALL of the above normally covered on warranty to illustrate my point. TheM3 being the least expensive to maintain in my experience

How come?

I bought my E46 M3 new and kept it for two years and it was as cheap as chips but the BMW warranty cover was excellent (generally speaking)

I can vouch for the BM's having owned some of those you mentioned and thus far with the RS, I would also buy the car again.

Which BM’s have you owned and why exactly would you buy the RS4 again?

See above......and the RS4 simply surf the forum, a summary might be I just fancied one, supercar performance, classy, stylish, practical, well built, fun, ......yawn, yawn

Is the decision that difficult

[Franzino]

This thread is beginning to irritate me.

What exactly do you want us to say. The vote is 90%. Do you want 100%. If so, buy a NEW CAR.

It's not about what I want you guys to say... I'm only gathering some info and opinions (good <-> bad) from people who know the RS4 better then me.... Simple as that...

[Franzino]

Easy, then buy a new car because the usage history of the car prior to your ownership will determine whether anything will go wrong soon. You can't do anything about that. AND obviously as the car has undergone more wear n tear your service costs increase considerably...its a secondhand car after all

100% correct

Is the decision that difficult

Indeed, that's why I'm gathering as much info as possible...

Thanks guys,

[derdle]

My better half had to chnage her company car last year. her new one was less than 500 miles old when it's turbo needed replacing. It then needed to go back several times for the work to be completed properly so that exhaust fumes didn't enter the cabin!

OK I know it was replaced under manufacturers warranty but its a reliability issue I'm getting at.

Reliability? Cost? New? Used? If you want a risk free life don't buy a car and go to live in the Outer Hebrides - you can walk everywhere and know that it'll rain everyday.

If you browse the forum I don't think you'll find anyone who has ever said "Worst thing I'd ever done" or "wish I'd bought a Corsa".

Go on, live a little, go and buy one and then live a lot!!!

[Doc]

Reliability? Cost? New? Used? If you want a risk free life don't buy a car and go to live in the Outer Hebrides - you can walk everywhere and know that it'll rain everyday.

....Go on, live a little, go and buy one and then live a lot!!!

Priceless

[don]

The way I see it is that if you buy a used RS4 these days, even low miles you are going to be saving around 40% or more on the new car cost. That's a huge saving and it's going to take a lot of expensive repairs, turbos, gear boxes, wheels etc., before you even get close to what you saved from NOT buying new, and if you choose wisely you probably wont have any big repairs at all.