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Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:40 am
by shanek
Hi all,
I am looking to change my brake pads in the very near future and am looking to head towards a more fast road/light track day pad. Has anyone on here used non OEM pads?
Currently looking at either EBC Yellow stuff or Ferodo DS2500 pads, just wondering if anyone has any feedback on either?
I recently did a trackday in my RS6 PE and was very impressed in all areas except the brakes but this was mostly due to the fluid boiling and giving a pretty scary brake pedal feel rather than a lack of braking power so I will also be putting some performance brake fluid and some braided lines on at the same time.
I am also considering replacing the front discs for a 2-piece floating option and have seen that VAGbremtechnic supply a direct replacement 2 piece disc (using an AP Racing rotor mated to a bell housing they make themselves).
https://www.vagbremtechnic.com/front-2- ... s-rda0007/
They have apparently sold quite a few of these and was wondering if any of you guys have them fitted and if so, are they any good?
I look forward to your responses.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:35 pm
by MikeFish
Heard that disc replacements were not worth the cost unless you go for OEM ceramics.
I've got a set of DS2500 being fitted on Friday with braided brake hoses and decent brake fluid. I've heard this is the best value upgrade. I know Pagid RS29 are good pads but I got a good deal on the Ferodo that made the Pagid seem a lot more expensive.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:54 pm
by shanek
Hi Mike, agree with the price of the RS29 pads, they look to be a more stable pad over the entire heat range but far too expensive.
What fluid did you go for? I ended up going for the Motul RBF 600 as it seemed a good price/performance trade off, I wanted to use Castrol React SRF fluid but its just far too expensive.
As for the brake discs, I dont think the Vagbremtechnic units are too much more (especially if bought at a sale time) than OEM units and once you put them on, each subsequent change only requires the outer rotor to be replaced which is much cheaper.
I will be interested to hear your thoughts on the DS2500's and braided lines when you get them installed.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:58 pm
by MikeFish
I got the same fluid; RBF 600.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:02 pm
by shanek
Hi Mike, Just wondering how you got on with the brake overhaul?
What are the DS2500 pads like, what is the cold feel/bite like?
Have you noticed any tangible difference in pedal feel with the new fluid and braided lines?
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:26 pm
by MikeFish
Hmmm, so i picked the car up as they were closing up for xmas. As i got in the the car the pedal went right down. I pumped it and it went hard (oi oi). But if I put any pressure on it, it would slowly drop again. So I started the car and just drove it back and forth in the car park. It seemed the brakes were working but the pedal felt wrong. So I went back in the garage (local independent that I've used many times before including changing hoses and brakes on my RS$ without any issues) and said there was something wrong. He said to me he knows what I mean (but didn't bother mentioning it before!!!). I asked if he bled it properly and he said he did it twice and checked everything was tight etc. Then said maybe it was due to new pads on old discs which sounded like nonsense to me, and that it might sort itself out. He suggested driving it for a while and taking it back in the new year if there was still an issue. As the brakes seemed to actually work still I agreed. As I drove it away it felt as though there was slight vibration each time I pressed the pedal too, not through the pads / discs, more like a electronically generated vibration, but could be me being paranoid.
So, I 'think' it has gone back to normal. Assuming a bit of air in the system and it has made it's way out. Or perhaps I have just got used to it now?
Hard to say therefore if it is any better as, if anything, it feels worse but not due to the brake lines if you know what I mean?
And with all the time spend at home over xmas and the near constant snow, ice and rain I've not really had much chance to do any enthusiastic testing. I have noticed that I and locking the front wheels a lot more often now. I don't recall many instances previously of the ABS cutting in but it seems to be happening a lot since the new brakes were fitted. I am assuming this is because the new pads are biting better than before and are now out gripping my front tyres (and partially due to tyre wear and colder temperatures but they were fine before the pas were changed). The front tyres were due to be replaced soon, but this has obviously highlighted their weakness so I am now looking for new tyres (got new Michelins on the back but still got the factory Dunlops on the front).
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:59 pm
by shanek
Oh dear, that sounds like a nightmare. Could well have been a bit (or a load) of air that has now migrated out of the system. Odd they didn't pump the brakes correctly after the second flush before you collected.
Interesting to hear about the fronts locking more now, I think thats a good sign for when the weather gets better, you get new tyres fitted and you get to give it a more enthusiastic drive.
With regards to tyre wear, did your fronts or rears wear out first? I was very confused and puzzled when I recently had to replace my fronts first as they were at the wear markers but the rears still had 4.5mm. Maybe its just my driving style (although I wore the rear tyres faster than the fronts on my previous S6) but for a supposed 40/60 front/rear torque split, I would have expected the rears to die first as I'm not shy of the accelerator.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:04 pm
by MikeFish
My RS4 wore out the rears quicker so I expected the same same here but I think the fronts have been wearing out quicker on my RS6 (probably all that weight on the brakes gives them a good run). When I got new tyres I put them on the rear and the worn tyres on the front so that they would wear out quicker and get replaced otherwise they could be hanging around for ages on the rear. Also, I have a set of 20" wheels so they my wheels get changed and rotated probably more often than most but pretty certain most wear was from the fronts (also as I'm lowered the fronts are prone to wear the inside edge away quicker).
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 9:49 pm
by Markp
MikeFish wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:26 pm
Hmmm, so i picked the car up as they were closing up for xmas. As i got in the the car the pedal went right down. I pumped it and it went hard (oi oi). But if I put any pressure on it, it would slowly drop again. So I started the car and just drove it back and forth in the car park. It seemed the brakes were working but the pedal felt wrong. So I went back in the garage (local independent that I've used many times before including changing hoses and brakes on my RS$ without any issues) and said there was something wrong. He said to me he knows what I mean (but didn't bother mentioning it before!!!). I asked if he bled it properly and he said he did it twice and checked everything was tight etc. Then said maybe it was due to new pads on old discs which sounded like nonsense to me, and that it might sort itself out. He suggested driving it for a while and taking it back in the new year if there was still an issue. As the brakes seemed to actually work still I agreed. As I drove it away it felt as though there was slight vibration each time I pressed the pedal too, not through the pads / discs, more like a electronically generated vibration, but could be me being paranoid.
So, I 'think' it has gone back to normal. Assuming a bit of air in the system and it has made it's way out. Or perhaps I have just got used to it now?
Hard to say therefore if it is any better as, if anything, it feels worse but not due to the brake lines if you know what I mean?
And with all the time spend at home over xmas and the near constant snow, ice and rain I've not really had much chance to do any enthusiastic testing. I have noticed that I and locking the front wheels a lot more often now. I don't recall many instances previously of the ABS cutting in but it seems to be happening a lot since the new brakes were fitted. I am assuming this is because the new pads are biting better than before and are now out gripping my front tyres (and partially due to tyre wear and colder temperatures but they were fine before the pas were changed). The front tyres were due to be replaced soon, but this has obviously highlighted their weakness so I am now looking for new tyres (got new Michelins on the back but still got the factory Dunlops on the front).
Mike this sounds like a brake downgrade, rather than an upgrade
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:15 pm
by MikeFish
I think it just wasn't bled properly Mark. Poor workmanship rather than a reflection of poor brake pads. It probably didn't help that I was driving my wife's RS3 and her brake pedal makes my RS4 and RS6 feel like they have a spongey pedal at the best of times (think they over-servo them as it always nearly puts my head through the windscreen when braking at slow speed in it).
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:22 pm
by Markp
MikeFish wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:15 pm
I think it just wasn't bled properly Mark. Poor workmanship rather than a reflection of poor brake pads. It probably didn't help that I was driving my wife's RS3 and her brake pedal makes my RS4 and RS6 feel like they have a spongey pedal at the best of times (think they over-servo them as it always nearly puts my head through the windscreen when braking at slow speed in it).
I am considering a RS3 later this year - might contact you re spec and experience if that is OK.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:44 pm
by MikeFish
Yes mate, no worries.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:25 pm
by LukasPukas
MikeFish wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:15 pm
I think it just wasn't bled properly Mark. Poor workmanship rather than a reflection of poor brake pads. It probably didn't help that I was driving my wife's RS3 and her brake pedal makes my RS4 and RS6 feel like they have a spongey pedal at the best of times (think they over-servo them as it always nearly puts my head through the windscreen when braking at slow speed in it).
I had a similar feel once when my brake line was nicked and leaking after my DRC was replaced.
Nearly killed me, so glad to hear it isn't that!
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:58 am
by becausephilchow
Ordering Hawk HPS 5.0 Pads, will be installing in the upcoming weeks.
Had great experiences with the Hawk HPSs before, and the 5.0 supposedly stops better, less dust, and everything, so figure I'd give them a shot.
Also doing some SS Lines and Fluid while i'm in there.
Re: Brake Pad Decisions
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 10:52 am
by MikeFish
As an update, I drove my wife's RS3 at the weekend and I didn't put my head through the windscreen when braking which means that my brake pedal feel must be back to normal.