Not happy at all....

[vestax32]

Obviously the main issue was the oil leak, which Oxford Audi found after removing the under tray, when doing a routine health check. Belfast should have seen this when they were doing the 140 point check. I can only presume the check wasn't carried out, or whoever did the check wasn't competent. Either way, I think I have reason to make a complaint. You can MOT at any time.

[Ian_C]

Isn't all this talk about complaining getting a little out of hand?

Going back to page 1 and all I can see is a crack in the windscreen and an oil leak that one garage found and another one didn't. The rocking driver's seat is commensurate with a very high mileage car previously owned by a guy who admitted he was quite heavy. The rest is just fluff and hysteria.

Maybe the dealer should have spotted the leak and the screen but I am struggling to find genuine evidence here of misrepresentation.

I sold my last car at 100K miles and it was immaculate. But it wasn't really, was it? As we all know, there is no such thing. It had some stone chips, and a little wheel kerbing, and the driver's seat was a little worn and the wheel a little shiny at the ten to two. I could go on, but you get the idea. It was a genuine car with an immaculate full service history. The battery packed up a week after I sold it but the person who bought it didn't start accusing me of subterfuge and fraud. He recognised he had a good car for a bargain price and he went out and bought a new battery.

This RS6 was a high mileage car and the previous owner was on here saying no expense had been spared, there is no evidence to the contrary and I have no reason to believe the first owner wasn't telling the truth. The car was priced accordingly. Had the OP had the engine out - and I understand it was going to be done under warranty - then it would have been all square and a bargain car.

My car is 18K miles and it has some stone chips, a windscreen chip and one little scuff on a wheel and a slight rattle at some speeds. I still think it's immaculate but then I live in the real world where everything is comparative. When I bought my car, I wanted it to be genuinely immaculate. So I bought a new one.

Not sure what all the fuss is about.

You don't deliver a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone with no number plates and no V5 tear off so they cannot tax or even make their own plates

You don't delivery a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone pissing oil or with a cracked windscreen! Windscreen is mot failure. Windscreen is dealer recalibration required due to the ADAS (adaptive driving assistance systems). The dealer then asking the customer to put the windscreen through insurance is defrauding the insurance company

[vestax32]

Isn't all this talk about complaining getting a little out of hand?

Going back to page 1 and all I can see is a crack in the windscreen and an oil leak that one garage found and another one didn't. The rocking driver's seat is commensurate with a very high mileage car previously owned by a guy who admitted he was quite heavy. The rest is just fluff and hysteria.

Maybe the dealer should have spotted the leak and the screen but I am struggling to find genuine evidence here of misrepresentation.

I sold my last car at 100K miles and it was immaculate. But it wasn't really, was it? As we all know, there is no such thing. It had some stone chips, and a little wheel kerbing, and the driver's seat was a little worn and the wheel a little shiny at the ten to two. I could go on, but you get the idea. It was a genuine car with an immaculate full service history. The battery packed up a week after I sold it but the person who bought it didn't start accusing me of subterfuge and fraud. He recognised he had a good car for a bargain price and he went out and bought a new battery.

This RS6 was a high mileage car and the previous owner was on here saying no expense had been spared, there is no evidence to the contrary and I have no reason to believe the first owner wasn't telling the truth. The car was priced accordingly. Had the OP had the engine out - and I understand it was going to be done under warranty - then it would have been all square and a bargain car.

My car is 18K miles and it has some stone chips, a windscreen chip and one little scuff on a wheel and a slight rattle at some speeds. I still think it's immaculate but then I live in the real world where everything is comparative. When I bought my car, I wanted it to be genuinely immaculate. So I bought a new one.

Not sure what all the fuss is about.

You don't deliver a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone with no number plates and no V5 tear off so they cannot tax or even make their own plates

You don't delivery a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone pissing oil or with a cracked windscreen! Windscreen is mot failure. Windscreen is dealer recalibration required due to the ADAS (adaptive driving assistance systems). The dealer then asking the customer to put the windscreen through insurance is defrauding the insurance company

Thank you Ian.

[vestax32]

To put you in the picture with the full extent of the cock ups, this is the letter I sent;

'I feel the need to write to you to detail a recent extremely poor experience I have had when buying an Approved Used Audi from Belfast Audi.



After initial contact with xxxxx, a deal was agreed, which included – I thought – a second year’s Audi Extended Warranty (which I will come back to later) and £43,750 paid. As I live in Oxfordshire, England, it was agreed that the car would be delivered. I took delivery of the car on the 19th of April. I immediately noticed the car had no number plates and queried it with the delivery driver, who informed me the car had been picked up with no plates. After the driver had left I also noticed the windscreen was cracked in the lower right hand corner, and on inspecting the collection form, it showed the crack as having been noted when the car was collected from Belfast Audi – which begs the question, why the car was released given the crack on the windscreen had been identified?!



I rang to inform xxxx of these issues, and was told number plates would be put in the post and that he would need to speak with his manager regarding the cracked windscreen. Xxxx called back and said I would need to get the windscreen repaired through my own insurance and the excess would be reimbursed. I called Autoglass to find that as the car has adaptive cruise control, a windscreen replacement was not a repair that could be done at home, and the car would therefore need to go to a special centre to have the screen fitted and the system recalibrated. The closest centre to me is over an hour away, and they would need the car for the whole day, meaning I would have to take a day off work, and get my wife to follow me there and take me back again.



I was not happy with this so called xxxx who said they would send someone to take the car for me, but I didn’t want a stranger driving the car, so it was agreed I would receive £300 to cover excess (£75) and (some) time off work. I had suggested the easiest way to sort this would be for Autoglass to replace the screen at Oxford Audi, then Audi could recalibrate the system after, but was informed by xxxx that Audi would charge £1500 for this, depleting the margin on the car so much that Belfast Audi would not make any money. I find this hard to believe, as I know what Audi trade-in values are like. While all this was going on, I still had not received any documentation (V5, warranty docs etc.), so could not tax the car. I finally received all of this, days after the car arrived, which leads me on to the next issues.



The second year’s warranty was supplied by an aftermarket company (Autoprotect), which was not mentioned at any point, and only discovered by myself when xxxx emailed the documentation days after the deal had been done and car delivered. When questioned I was told it offered the same level of cover as the genuine Audi product, but having researched this online I found literally hundreds of shocking reviews for the Autoprotect warranty, clearly showing it is in no way the same as a genuine Audi Warranty. Xxxx told me it was impossible for them to give me a second year’s Audi warranty, however I was given two years genuine Audi warranty when I bought my C6 RS6 from Harrogate Audi, so it is clearly possible. In the end I asked that the premium (£600) for the aftermarket warranty be given back to me and I would put it towards renewing the second year’s warranty when the time came. This was agreed, but money was not transferred.



Another issue, the car was pulling slightly so I had a 4 wheel laser alignment done and all 4 wheels were quite a way out. I don’t know if alignment is supposed to be included in Audi’s 140 point approved used check?



The next issue was that the car was delivered to me without a new MOT, even though the MOT was due in 3 months. I would have thought with a short MOT the car should have been MOT’d prior to delivery. With this in mind I rang xxxxx and asked the MOT fee be covered by Belfast Audi, which was agreed, and the car was booked into Oxford Audi for the MOT. It also had a ‘rocking’ drivers seat (worn runners), which they would also look at. Whilst the car was in with Oxford Audi (another massive inconvenience for me, which I shouldn’t be having given I have just spent a lot of money on a supposedly “Approved Used” Audi) I had a phone call informing me they had removed the undertray to perform a routine health check and found an oil leak, which would need to be investigated. Later that day I received another phone call informing me in order to repair the oil leak the engine and gearbox would need to be removed, a 28 hour job, and they would need to have the car for 2 weeks. It was at this point I decided the car would have to be returned.



I rang and spoke with the sales manager, informed him of the issues, and demanded the car be collected and I be refunded in full, to which he agreed. Absolutely no sign of an apology, or any kind of explanation for why the car would have left Belfast Audi with such a serious fault. The car was used for transporting my two year old daughter and heavily pregnant wife; with such a serious fault I dread to think what could have happened had I not, by chance, had the car into Oxford Audi for the other issues.



The car was collected on the 11th May, and I was told by xxxx that my refund would be actioned as soon as they had confirmation from the transport company that they had collected the car. This was clearly a lie, as I then received a phone call from xxxx on the 13th May informing me the car was back at Belfast Audi and they were going to charge me for one of the wheels bing curbed. xxxx informed me the collection note from the transport company showed one of the wheels to be damaged when the car was collected. The copy of the note that was given to my wife (I was not present when the car was collected), showed no such detail. In fact, my wife said that the driver did not even look round the car, just put it on the trailer and left. My wife is a detective with Thames Valley Police, so I would suggest it to be unlikely she is lying.



In conclusion, I am absolutely shocked and amazed at the way I have been treated by Belfast Audi, and by the poor state of the (Approved Used) Audi that was delivered to me. I do not expect any compensation as I know this is unlikely, but I would like acknowledgement of the poor service I have received, and assurance that the correct avenues will be pursued in order for this not to happen again. Surely this can’t be a good representation of the Audi brand.

I look forward to receiving your response.'

[MikeFish]

You blanked the dude's name out in most of that but left it unblanked in the MOT paragraph and twice in the refund / curbed wheel paragraph.

[vestax32]

You blanked the dude's name out in most of that but left it unblanked in the MOT paragraph and twice in the refund / curbed wheel paragraph.

Oops, bit fiddly on my phone. Edited.

[kmpowell]

The car was used for transporting my two year old daughter and heavily pregnant wife; with such a serious fault I dread to think what could have happened had I not, by chance, had the car into Oxford Audi for the other issues.

I feel your frustration, but IMO this bit was slightly unnecessary. If it were me receiving the email you would have lost a bit of sympathy for your genuine points. Perhaps I've misread but I do not see how an oil leak would have any bearing on your daughter and pregnant wife's safety?

[vestax32]

The car was used for transporting my two year old daughter and heavily pregnant wife; with such a serious fault I dread to think what could have happened had I not, by chance, had the car into Oxford Audi for the other issues.

I feel your frustration, but IMO this bit was slightly unnecessary. If it were me receiving the email you would have lost a bit of sympathy for your genuine points. Perhaps I've misread but I do not see how an oil leak would have any bearing on your daughter and pregnant wife's safety?

I know what you're saying, but I'm no mechanic, and if an issue is serious enough to require the engine and gearbox be removed, it sounds like it's serious enough to potentially be dangerous. Unlikely but a fair point I think.

Either way, I'm not expecting to get anything out of it, but needed to vent for my own piece of mind. I'll post any response if/when I get one.

[Bit_evl]

Inclined to agree with KMP. Stick to breach of contract issues and poor prep against Audis public standards. If the windscreen is bad and breaches MOT guidelines then it means your car was shipped in an illegal state and therefore the insurance could have been invalid had you driven it.

Ask the good lady wife about the finer points of failure to provide duty of care for the mechanical state of the vehicle on public roads.
Show they have consistently lied on the condition.

This is exactly what I meant about my MB experience. This was a salerep trying to maximise his profit. They have leeway on repairs against a vehicle untill they hit break even in which case the sales manager may want to sign off. Sounds like he was trying to avoid any and all repairs. This is lack of oversight on the release of the vehicle. If it took the removal of the undertray to find the oil leak then it could be a simple miss on the most expensive and worst issue. I would not hang them for everything. Sounds like you have enough to hang them on already.

For the plate I would guess they took off a Northern Irish plate and submitted the paperwork for re-assignment of a traditional GB plate. Believe me whilst the NI plate is legal you don't want it on an RS6, ask your wife. APNS and Mk1 Police braincells will mean a regular stopping at a guess. This plate change is normal practice and does not surprise me. This would result in the various people sending paperwork. Like putting on a private plate, it would come from DVLA as well as them once they had sent the rest off. This is just process. Not attractive but common for NI to mainland.

I would add three key elements and a hammer.
1. Breach of trust, they failed to honor a commitment and so breach of trust is sufficient to cause rejection of the vehicle. Damages would be something you would need to show and would be very difficult given they had already offered to recover several of the issues which shows good intent but also acknowledges failure of the vehicle preparation standards.
2. Delivering a vehicle knowing it to be illegal for use on public roads (windscreen?) if the crack was outside legal guidelines.
3. Attempt to defraud insurance with the windscreen is a bad one, but again common. Porsche Centre Guildford did the same to me on the purchase of a 968CS many years ago. Arrived with the rear wash wipe N/Func. When asked they said they did not have that item on the test sheet for a CS as it was not factory standard (it had been fitted by them post sale!) and if I could give it 30 days they would do it under the Porsche Warranty they had provided with the car. At least it was a Porsche Warranty.
4. Indeed a call from the wife (clearly highlighting she is not acting in a legal capacity to ensure no conflict with her work) would possibly have been most effective. In my experience the training you get in the Police means that your voice/manner alone tends to control a situation very well.

This feels like a rep trying it on.

[vestax32]

I have had a reply from Andre Konsbruck's PA saying someone in his team will contact me shortly. No reply from the MD at Belfast as yet...

[wildbore]

You don't deliver a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone with no number plates and no V5 tear off so they cannot tax or even make their own plates

You don't delivery a 2.5 year old 45k car to someone pissing oil or with a cracked windscreen! Windscreen is mot failure. Windscreen is dealer recalibration required due to the ADAS (adaptive driving assistance systems). The dealer then asking the customer to put the windscreen through insurance is defrauding the insurance company

You haven't seen the size of the oil leak and neither have I; I doubt it was "pissing" oil, though. Indeed, I suspect the OP didn't seen it, either. One garage found it (it was in their interests to do so) and another didn't, which was sloppy of them.

I haven't seen the OP describe the windscreen crack's dimensions but it doesn't sound like an MoT failure at all - especially as it is not in the driver's field of vision. Maybe it was so small that the selling garage missed it, too. Again, sloppy. And I agree that it is unethical / fraudulent to ask the purchaser to put it through insurance.

What we have is a garage that was sloppy and naughty. They were out of order. OP wasn't happy and correctly complained. They took the car back and refunded in full at significant cost to them. I would say that the OP was right to bang out a letter of complaint, but this whole thread has whipped up into a storm way beyond proportion. Just saying.

[Ian_C]

I have had a reply from Andre Konsbruck's PA saying someone in his team will contact me shortly. No reply from the MD at Belfast as yet...

Audi UK run the Audi Driving Experiences at Silverstone. Definitely worth asking nicely. They must surely sponsor these for R8 customers, VIPs, serial Audi buyers etc

[doodlebug]

They do, ish.

[vestax32]

I have had a reply from Andre Konsbruck's PA saying someone in his team will contact me shortly. No reply from the MD at Belfast as yet...

Audi UK run the Audi Driving Experiences at Silverstone. Definitely worth asking nicely. They must surely sponsor these for R8 customers, VIPs, serial Audi buyers etc

This sounds like a nice idea ;o)

[vestax32]

I have now also had contact from someone high up at Belfast who is contacting me on Wednesday to discuss.